YouGov: Divisive Poll re BJ & Starmer's Performances

[Borchester]

From what I'm seeing at the moment, there is a very strong campaign by the people who were involved in Vote Leave financing to have the Electoral commission abolished (it's all over social media the last few days).



Their reasoning is that because they were found innocent of one of the charges against them, the electoral commission is corrupt and must be shut down.

I don't see it. Assuming that the Brexiters tend towards the Tories I would imagine that they are tickled pink by the Electoral Commission. The latter wants to make boundary changes that will be to the advantage of the Conservative party. Personally I am surprised that Boris did not name his boy after Bob Posner , the commissions CEO.

[Borg Refinery]

From what I'm seeing at the moment, there is a very strong campaign by the people who were involved in Vote Leave financing to have the Electoral commission abolished (it's all over social media the last few days).



Their reasoning is that because they were found innocent of one of the charges against them, the electoral commission is corrupt and must be shut down.



They conveniently left out that they and their friends have been found guilty of various other charges which did stick.



Now, if the electoral commission is abolished, the dictator scenario you mention is much more likely because elections, if they can even be held at all, there will be no way to ensure a fair fight or even absence of criminal manipulation.



What do you think happens in politics if there are no rules on how elections and campaigns should be run, or at least no longer any way to enforce those rules?



This campaign to me is very clear evidence that these people want to take more control of the country, and they most definitely do not want inconvenient things like democratic checks and balances getting in their way.

Thanks Jav.



Very, very important news and very much worthy of a devoted thread IMHO. I hadn't heard about this.

[Javert]

Gosh, I haven't spent all these years voting and thinking carefully who to put on government benches to throw the towel in for a dictator, whatever shade of hypocrisy he might wear. Sadly this crisis is showing true character and up to now I don't like it.

From what I'm seeing at the moment, there is a very strong campaign by the people who were involved in Vote Leave financing to have the Electoral commission abolished (it's all over social media the last few days).



Their reasoning is that because they were found innocent of one of the charges against them, the electoral commission is corrupt and must be shut down.



They conveniently left out that they and their friends have been found guilty of various other charges which did stick.



Now, if the electoral commission is abolished, the dictator scenario you mention is much more likely because elections, if they can even be held at all, there will be no way to ensure a fair fight or even absence of criminal manipulation.



What do you think happens in politics if there are no rules on how elections and campaigns should be run, or at least no longer any way to enforce those rules?



This campaign to me is very clear evidence that these people want to take more control of the country, and they most definitely do not want inconvenient things like democratic checks and balances getting in their way.

[T00ts]

Ok I'd like to stick to the 'normal politics' side of things for a moment.



The reason Starmer iS leader of the Labour party is because just before normality came crashing about our heads, the core labour vote disappeared up its own arse in their worst election performance since, well, pretty much ever, really.



Now I'm sure there are a whole load of reasons for that, but for most purposes here I say that is axdiversion.



Fact is, Labour bombed, Boris got control of seats unthinkable since before world war one, and the fallout from that was a five ? way fight to put Corbyn back in his box and this time nail it shut and elect a replacement.



The replacement was the front runner by a country mile from the very start and absolutely romped home.



I cannot myself envisage ANY scenario in which the winner of a leadership contest by such a margin, from such a shambles, whose firstvtask was replacing the wackos and arseholes as Corbyn had to work with because no sensible career politician would, could possibly NOT have soared.



Against that, comparison with government performance is pointless.



All thats happening here is Starmers enjoying a honeymoon period.

 :hattip

[johnofgwent]

Ok I'd like to stick to the 'normal politics' side of things for a moment.



The reason Starmer iS leader of the Labour party is because just before normality came crashing about our heads, the core labour vote disappeared up its own arse in their worst election performance since, well, pretty much ever, really.



Now I'm sure there are a whole load of reasons for that, but for most purposes here I say that is axdiversion.



Fact is, Labour bombed, Boris got control of seats unthinkable since before world war one, and the fallout from that was a five ? way fight to put Corbyn back in his box and this time nail it shut and elect a replacement.



The replacement was the front runner by a country mile from the very start and absolutely romped home.



I cannot myself envisage ANY scenario in which the winner of a leadership contest by such a margin, from such a shambles, whose firstvtask was replacing the wackos and arseholes as Corbyn had to work with because no sensible career politician would, could possibly NOT have soared.



Against that, comparison with government performance is pointless.



All thats happening here is Starmers enjoying a honeymoon period.

[T00ts]

Join the club.

 ::  ::  yes but mine is not necessarily permanent!

[papasmurf]

 I have rarely felt quite so pessimistic.

Join the club.

[T00ts]

Several schools of thought here;



A) yours

B) Crisis brings out people's true character and you see what they are really about.

C) This IS going to be 'normal' govt for the foreseeable future if some predictions that reach past 2022 are correct ( I hope not, please no..).

D) That we should just suspend parliament and just let PM rule from No 10.



I disagree with option D but I think your idea and the other 2 all have merit.

Gosh, I haven't spent all these years voting and thinking carefully who to put on government benches to throw the towel in for a dictator, whatever shade of hypocrisy he might wear. Sadly this crisis is showing true character and up to now I don't like it.

Mistakes have been made long before this hit us. Lack of preparation and forethought, complacency, and sheer single minded focus on one aspect of government and possibly divorce/girlfriends and now we are struggling to shut the stable door while the horse is going at breakneck speed. Circumstances of almost negligent proportions have created a situation where we have been racing from behind with little hope of catching up. I will be surprised if we escape another shut down and/or huge numbers of deaths. I have rarely felt quite so pessimistic.

[Borg Refinery]

Surely it's irrelevant as things are. Normal government and opposition is on hold. Westminster is 'functioning' but only just and there is little chance to really see characters and proper debate. It's all happening in too much of a vacuum to make a judgement.

Several schools of thought here;



A) yours

B) Crisis brings out people's true character and you see what they are really about.

C) This IS going to be 'normal' govt for the foreseeable future if some predictions that reach past 2022 are correct ( I hope not, please no..).

D) That we should just suspend parliament and just let PM rule from No 10.



I disagree with option D but I think your idea and the other 2 all have merit.

[T00ts]

Surely it's irrelevant as things are. Normal government and opposition is on hold. Westminster is 'functioning' but only just and there is little chance to really see characters and proper debate. It's all happening in too much of a vacuum to make a judgement.

[Borg Refinery]

Labour are 31% of the House of Commons and are HM opposition, so he will get a good hearing. He might even be Prime Minister in 2024.

It's a divisive poll when you compare it to Corbyn and Johnson's polling ratings, but thank you Ned.

[Barry]

Labour are 31% of the House of Commons and are HM opposition, so he will get a good hearing. He might even be Prime Minister in 2024.

[papasmurf]

What do you expect with Bojo the Clown as Prime Minister.

[Borg Refinery]

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/keir-starmer-approval-rating-boris-johnson-first-time-a4438786.html%3Famp">https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.standa ... html%3famp">https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/keir-starmer-approval-rating-boris-johnson-first-time-a4438786.html%3famp



A YouGov survey carried out over the weekend found that 40 per cent of Brits believe the Labour leader is doing either "fairly well" or "very well" and 17 per cent think he is performing "fairly badly" or "very badly".



The Prime Minister is more divisive – 57 per cent think he is doing "fairly well" or "very well," while 35 per cent think he is doing "fairly badly" or "very badly", the survey found.



This gives Sir Keir, who became Labour leader in April, a one-point lead over Mr Johnson.

----



I'm amazed he's at 57% but there you go...turkeys and xmas.