Smart meters E.ON

[Baron von Lotsov]

Perhaps but not the full story it will give them the ability to alter unit prices at peak times and on occasions when all the kettles go on like ht at an important footie match.



Don't ask for the link for this cos I read it a while ago but it's along the same lines as tesco who want to replace the paper price points on shelves with digital ones that look almost identical so they can hike the prices at peak times by clicking a mouse.

There seems to be a pretty good correlation between firms who screw around with pricing, which in my experience is both Tescos and Morrisons, and the amount you pay for the same thing. You see there is a certain price a consumer will pay for a certain thing, but if that price can look cheaper than it really is then it means they can screw you for more. These days if I see a firm doing this I'll walk away from it or screw them.

[cromwell]

That's not why they want them. They are building a "smart" grid which knows who is using what and how much wind is blowing. Remember all those arguments about the wind does not blow all of the time and nor does the sun shine every day, well think it through. On a  non-windy day prices will be hiked. You can only do it with a real-time data feed, and that's what this is.

Perhaps but not the full story it will give them the ability to alter unit prices at peak times and on occasions when all the kettles go on like ht at an important footie match.



Don't ask for the link for this cos I read it a while ago but it's along the same lines as tesco who want to replace the paper price points on shelves with digital ones that look almost identical so they can hike the prices at peak times by clicking a mouse.

[Baron von Lotsov]

 And when you think on it, how hard is it to read the gas and lecky meters?

That's not why they want them. They are building a "smart" grid which knows who is using what and how much wind is blowing. Remember all those arguments about the wind does not blow all of the time and nor does the sun shine every day, well think it through. On a  non-windy day prices will be hiked. You can only do it with a real-time data feed, and that's what this is.

[Barry]

My bill for electricity has not risen in real terms for a long time, due to being careful with usage, and also as electrical domestic appliances have died and been replaced the new ones are far more efficient.

My electricity supplier also has a deal (which the don't advertise,) where for a small prepayment the price per unit is fixed for three years.

I know how much electricity each appliance uses, so I don't need a smart meter.

Actually, very good points here:

Nearly every light bulb in our house is LED. The boiler is a fairly efficient combi. I switch things off not in use. I take a shower every Christmas, whether I need one or not.    What more can we do?



Energy companies are trying to convince us to reduce our consumption, to be good for planetary resources. They are encouraging us to reduce their quantity of sales. However they will need to maintain their profit margins and employ the same number of people, so they will be unable to keep their unit prices down.

Their unit prices will therefore increase, so overall, even though we will use less, we will still pay about the same. It's the infrastructure and overheads which are expensive.

Then there are those unwanted smart meters we are all paying for.  :thdwn:

[papasmurf]

 And when you think on it, how hard is it to read the gas and lecky meters?

No mains gas where I live, the easiness of reading the electricity meter is weather dependent. The meter is outside in a box on the wall. (Needs a key to open it.)

[Borchester]

Yes there are issues with the current hardware which I think is expected at such a large (nationwide) rollout. These problems will be pretty costly for the local distributor (in OPs case E.ON) but long term to drawbacks of the transition period will greatly outweigh the old system of metering.

We were with E.ON for several years and they were fine, albeit pricey. But then they got very pricey and it became impossible to sort matters out so moved to Shell, since when our bills gave fallen by a third. I keep being told of the exciting advantages of smart meters but to my way of thinking I would not help out Shell so why should they help me? And when you think on it, how hard is it to read the gas and lecky meters?

[papasmurf]

My bill for electricity has not risen in real terms for a long time, due to being careful with usage, and also as electrical domestic appliances have died and been replaced the new ones are far more efficient.

My electricity supplier also has a deal (which the don't advertise,) where for a small prepayment the price per unit is fixed for three years.

I know how much electricity each appliance uses, so I don't need a smart meter.

[Baron von Lotsov]

Yes there are issues with the current hardware which I think is expected at such a large (nationwide) rollout. These problems will be pretty costly for the local distributor (in OPs case E.ON) but long term to drawbacks of the transition period will greatly outweigh the old system of metering.

Nah, some workman in the design department has seriously fcked up.



There will be a reason why 39% of the displays fail. A serious electronics firm has a strict system of quality control. You prototype the design first, and you keep testing it until all the bugs are out. If almost one in two are faulty it means they have failed. I expect they were good with their professional sales pitch for the contract though.

[Baron von Lotsov]

In what context ?



Certainly the fact that you have used a certain amount of kwH is "personally identifiable financial data" within the meanings of the various data protection acts. Which means the company has obviously got the right to use t to bill you, but anything and everything else can obnly be done with your consent.

That's how it works. Your private life is protected by default and they have to ask your permission for information, so you agree to tell them what they need to know in order to do the business. A classic one is, when you order stuff you give them your address and name and so on, and that is for the purpose of sending you your order so if they then use that data to spam you then they are breaking the law. So if they want to do social research for their climate change project to see how many times you boil a kettle then they have to ask, and of course you can tell em where to go. One way around it is anonymous data. It might be why they want these meters, but in general the more the government know about you the more power they have.

[papasmurf]

Yes there are issues with the current hardware which I think is expected at such a large (nationwide) rollout. These problems will be pretty costly for the local distributor (in OPs case E.ON) but long term to drawbacks of the transition period will greatly outweigh the old system of metering.

They will fit a smart meter to my home over my dead body. (Other than the problems I have referenced they don't save any money.)

[Nalaar]

You are ignoring the many problems caused by smart meter to customers.

(Which are detailed in a link I posted earlier with links embedded in it.)

Yes there are issues with the current hardware which I think is expected at such a large (nationwide) rollout. These problems will be pretty costly for the local distributor (in OPs case E.ON) but long term to drawbacks of the transition period will greatly outweigh the old system of metering.

[papasmurf]

I use to work for E.ON a few years ago back when Smart Meters where just starting out, I think they're a great idea. The number of issues caused by incorrect or estimated meter readings (especially in Rented properties), and faulty meters, had a significant impact on our daily workload.

You are ignoring the many problems caused by smart meter to customers.

(Which are detailed in a link I posted earlier with links embedded in it.)



Then there is this:-

more at link:-

https://www.energylivenews.com/2019/08/29/more-than-a-third-of-smart-meter-users-report-having-problems/">https://www.energylivenews.com/2019/08/ ... -problems/">https://www.energylivenews.com/2019/08/29/more-than-a-third-of-smart-meter-users-report-having-problems/



Thursday 29th August 2019



More than a third of smart meter users report having problems'

New research suggests the number of people having issues totals around four million, with just over a year to go until the installation deadline



The study notes 39% of the issues relate to smart displays not working, while 32% of those who reported problems said devices went 'dumb' after switching and 13% said their meters ceased functioning entirely.

A third of households with second generation "SMETS2" meters have also encountered issues since they were installed, despite these newer models not being expected to experience technical problems.

[Nalaar]

I use to work for E.ON a few years ago back when Smart Meters where just starting out, I think they're a great idea. The number of issues caused by incorrect or estimated meter readings (especially in Rented properties), and faulty meters, had a significant impact on our daily workload.

[johnofgwent]

Right to privacy?



I wonder if it can be applied to electricity usage data.

In what context ?



Certainly the fact that you have used a certain amount of kwH is "personally identifiable financial data" within the meanings of the various data protection acts. Which means the company has obviously got the right to use t to bill you, but anything and everything else can obnly be done with your consent.

[johnofgwent]

I want to change supplier in the next couple of months and was really put off by reports of cheaper suppliers going bust. I was with Sainsburys who offloaded me onto British Gas who started pushing for me to sign up with a new contract - with 14 days notice - a couple of weeks before the GE. I thought the timing was interesting. My contract finishes in March and so far I have ignored them. They tell me I no longer have access to that particular offer. I feel manipulated, not a comfortable feeling. I have known marriages end for less.

I think Barry had interesting experiences with suppliers going bust, but I may have confused him with someone else. I recall it wasn't pretty.



Frankly, who can tell what will happen tomorrow !  



In the past, I failed to follow the advice I give others today. When Tranche 4 deregulation came about, I switched from British Gas to Swalec because I was one of the IT team actually providing the systems to Swalec and the tales I could tell you of those days (!!) but I then styed with them for far too long after they became EDF, then I switched to Eon and then to Npower as switching sites suggested I might do better. But I always had a nagging feeling i was not getting the best deal. In the end I switched to Ovo for a very good one year deal, which i renewed, but I then found them less competitive and very, very inflexible over the direct debit payments which seemed to be making them several hundred pounds profit on my bills over the whole year - far from me being in surplus some time and in deficit for some other parts, i was in slight surplus some months and massively in surplus for the rest. So I dumped them.



I need to look very, very hard at what the real situation with Octopus is, because i feel I have once again been in surolus throughout the year, and I do not see why that has to be. But the coldest quarter is yet to hit, so we shall see.



I certainly don't feel pushed around or enslaved to Octopus - their contract clearly says I can leave tomorrow if I want ...