Did Gray Fall or was she pushed?

[cromwell]

Well one thing we agree on is that it stinks , the whole rotten lot of them . But Johnson and his cohorts have gone ,its now Starmer and his  in the spotlight ,one that they are finding a tad hot at the moment .

Then I'm sure someone will be along shortly to gift? An air conditioning system 

[Streetwalker]

re Pincher the allegations were worse than that and were what ended Boris who'd just beaten off a no confidence vote. Javid and Sunak resigned when Boris admitted to his cabinet he'd misled them and then Starmer absolutely skewered him at PMQs and the mass resignations from his government started.   

As for Gray it was incompetence, she was supposedly investigating Boris for not meeting the standards of government, failed to investigate the worst examples claiming the police were and didn't go back to investigate them when they didn't pursue them.  It stinks.

More detail here: https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/boris-johnson-partygate-sue-gray-report-b2086905.html

Well one thing we agree on is that it stinks , the whole rotten lot of them . But Johnson and his cohorts have gone ,its now Starmer and his  in the spotlight ,one that they are finding a tad hot at the moment .

[Unlucky4Sum]

She only 'investigated' the allegations that were already in the public domain ,the ones which she decided Johnson was guilty of were her opinion not fact or even legally accountable . The police didn't have enough evidence to charge him with anything and though I would agree the Pincher bloke was a homosexual pest I don't think anyone accused him of anything but pinching blokes arses and and making lurid suggestions . A bit under the bar of 'sexual perversion' for me . They are all grown ups and if they were that offended a right hook would have ended it .

Sue Gray will no doubt be in the House of Lords by the time  Starmer leaves Downing street

re Pincher the allegations were worse than that and were what ended Boris who'd just beaten off a no confidence vote. Javid and Sunak resigned when Boris admitted to his cabinet he'd misled them and then Starmer absolutely skewered him at PMQs and the mass resignations from his government started.   

As for Gray it was incompetence, she was supposedly investigating Boris for not meeting the standards of government, failed to investigate the worst examples claiming the police were and didn't go back to investigate them when they didn't pursue them.  It stinks.

More detail here: https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/boris-johnson-partygate-sue-gray-report-b2086905.html

[srb7677]

You can sleep well ,I was well a kip when you posted . Johnson is well down my list of political hero's in fact he is not even on it .I was merely reminding that it was the independent Sue Gray who completely undermined her own report when she joined Labour . If the Johnson saga had ever got to court her findings would have been dismissed and her own part in it ridiculed .
 

Thanks for the clarification on your view of Johnson. And also you may have a point, though had it gone to court any evidence would have spoken for itself if it was indisputable. I very much doubt that her findings would ever have made it to court anyway because hers was not a criminal investigation. If it had ever gotten to court it would have been as the result of evidence uncovered by a police investigation with her having little to do with it.

[papasmurf]

If the Johnson saga had ever got to court her findings would have been dismissed and her own part in it ridiculed .
 

I doubt that. Because of the documented and referenced evidence.

https://www.instituteforgovernment.org.uk/article/comment/sue-grays-report-shows-how-boris-johnson-has-damaged-office-prime-minister

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/1078404/2022-05-25_FINAL_FINDINGS_OF_SECOND_PERMANENT_SECRETARY_INTO_ALLEGED_GATHERINGS.pdf

[Streetwalker]

You are coming dangerously close to shooting down their alternate reality balloon with your truth arrows. Many here are so ideologically committed to Brexit, that it distorts their assessment of reality, to the point where they see Boris as their hero and champion, brought down by a Remainer establishment, a wronged political hero second only to the saintly Nigel.

I am being sarcastic about them of course but as we both know, sarcasm only works if there is a grain of truth to it. I expect a usual suspect pile on now, which I am not hanging around for. Bed time for me,

You can sleep well ,I was well a kip when you posted . Johnson is well down my list of political hero's in fact he is not even on it .I was merely reminding that it was the independent Sue Gray who completely undermined her own report when she joined Labour . If the Johnson saga had ever got to court her findings would have been dismissed and her own part in it ridiculed .
 

[Streetwalker]

More the opposite.  Her incompetence in that inquiry saved his bacon.  She failed to investigate all the allegations because she was told the police were investigating the other ones - and of course they were not.  What did for Boris was him enabling Pincher to carry out his sick perversions with all the power of the Whip's office.

My view is she knew the game was up so went to Starmer with a plan.  She'll be heading some well paid private consultancy in a couple of years. 

She only 'investigated' the allegations that were already in the public domain ,the ones which she decided Johnson was guilty of were her opinion not fact or even legally accountable . The police didn't have enough evidence to charge him with anything and though I would agree the Pincher bloke was a homosexual pest I don't think anyone accused him of anything but pinching blokes arses and and making lurid suggestions . A bit under the bar of 'sexual perversion' for me . They are all grown ups and if they were that offended a right hook would have ended it .

Sue Gray will no doubt be in the House of Lords by the time  Starmer leaves Downing street

[srb7677]

More the opposite.  Her incompetence in that inquiry saved his bacon.  She failed to investigate all the allegations because she was told the police were investigating the other ones - and of course they were not.  What did for Boris was him enabling Pincher to carry out his sick perversions with all the power of the Whip's office.

My view is she knew the game was up so went to Starmer with a plan.  She'll be heading some well paid private consultancy in a couple of years. 

You are coming dangerously close to shooting down their alternate reality balloon with your truth arrows. Many here are so ideologically committed to Brexit, that it distorts their assessment of reality, to the point where they see Boris as their hero and champion, brought down by a Remainer establishment, a wronged political hero second only to the saintly Nigel.

I am being sarcastic about them of course but as we both know, sarcasm only works if there is a grain of truth to it. I expect a usual suspect pile on now, which I am not hanging around for. Bed time for me,

[Unlucky4Sum]

Well whether she was pushed or she jumped doesn't really matter to me . The fact that Starmer couldn't find a role for her so made one up so she could keep drawing a salary from the public purse does though . A part time role apparently this region's envoy gig ,honestly you couldn't make this up .

The independent civil servant Gray did much to get rid of Boris is certainly being paid well for her service

More the opposite.  Her incompetence in that inquiry saved his bacon.  She failed to investigate all the allegations because she was told the police were investigating the other ones - and of course they were not.  What did for Boris was him enabling Pincher to carry out his sick perversions with all the power of the Whip's office.

My view is she knew the game was up so went to Starmer with a plan.  She'll be heading some well paid private consultancy in a couple of years. 

[Streetwalker]

Reportedly resigned today but given another post something about the 4 nations. The roller coaster continues except  it doesn't seem to have any ups just horrendous downs. Hang on tight Keir you won't be long behind.

Well whether she was pushed or she jumped doesn't really matter to me . The fact that Starmer couldn't find a role for her so made one up so she could keep drawing a salary from the public purse does though . A part time role apparently this region's envoy gig ,honestly you couldn't make this up .

The independent civil servant Gray did much to get rid of Boris is certainly being paid well for her service

[srb7677]

Reportedly resigned today but given another post something about the 4 nations. The roller coaster continues except  it doesn't seem to have any ups just horrendous downs. Hang on tight Keir you won't be long behind.

If you think Keir Starmer is going anywhere anytime soon with the stonking great majority he has you are engaging in wishful thinking. We the people will not get the chance until the next election. The only people who can get rid of him before then is his own MPs, and that aint going to be happening anytime soon. And even if it did he is unlikely to be replaced by anyone any more to your liking.

As for there being no ups, well as a well heeled retiree you would say that. But my best friend works for the DWP and has had her first real terms pay rise as opposed to real terms pay cut since she started there 7 years ago. So that looks like an up to her. The fact that the government has recognised that the recruitment and retention crisis throughout the public sector was mostly down to year on year de facto pay cuts and that more of the same would only worsen it, is an obvious up. If we are going to recruit and retain the staff we need they need to be adequately paid. Because if those services collapse it will cost us a whole lot more and we were getting close to that.

As for Sue Grey's departure, I don't really care all that much. Internal power struggle? Maybe. But it was ever thus no matter who was in charge. A certain Cummings spent considerable time and effort trashing his former boss after the latter's Mrs engineered his downfall. I doubt whether we will see something so unseemly now, especially since Sue Grey is still working for the government in a different role.

If the resignation of an aide is all they've got to suggest chaos at the top then it is pretty feeble. Had a minister resigned, had Grey herself dissed the government in some way, it might have constituted important news. At the moment it really is small beer. Am not interested enough in the matter to have much more of an opinion on it than that

[Barry]

Sir Kier Starmer:

https://twitter.com/Keir_Starmer/status/1809123938066211032

July 5th:

We said we will stop the chaos. And we will.

We said we will turn the page. And we have.

The work of change begins today.

6th October
Kier might say:
"This job seems harder than I thought. Boris did quite a good job compared to my effort so far."

[cromwell]

New job new wardrobe 

[T00ts]

Reportedly resigned today but given another post something about the 4 nations. The roller coaster continues except  it doesn't seem to have any ups just horrendous downs. Hang on tight Keir you won't be long behind.