Israel v Gaza

[johnofgwent]

I can understand Johns thinking on this,people who believe they are chosen other religions who believe they and only they and their path is right.

How many people have been murdered in pursuit and adherence in their surety of that belief?

So many say they believe in the same God but what sort of a god other than one with a twisted logic would see the carnage by those adhering to what they believe on the one true path?

I used to believe there was a god.

Now I say openly I don't know, and to myself I suspect there isn't one. I will find out soon enough.

My beliefs and values for the last forty years assume you get one go on this slime covered eight thousand mile wide third rock from the sun.


I take it as self evident you are a long time nonexistent, muck about here for an insignificant time then spend a long time dead.

Lots of people with money and power convince lots more to voluntarily curtail their existence and praise their heroic sacrifice.

I will not bore you with detail but there are plenty of examples to be found where actually there is a pressing case their sacrifice saved many.

Some are persuaded to it for love of country, of power or money if they return.

But I find some - who rarely lead from the front - call for it, demand it or force it upon their cult followers in the name of their supreme being and for greater rewards in a supposed afterlife.

I consider those who urge that "sacrifice" the lowest of the low, unto whom should be done every possible act to prevent their post death existence if any from receiving the rewards it urged others to claim.

If that breaks some snowflakes idea of human rights then do the same to that snowflake.

If you really want peace, kill all the priests, and then ensure their corpses are treated in a way their religion says guarantees them denial of entry to their paradise.

Then when there are no more priests, we can get somewhere

[T00ts]

I do try as hard as I can but like everyone I fail abysmally. Sometimes I feel it must be somewhat easier if there is no knowledge or belief, because once it is known, understood and accepted it simply can't be denied. However we are here to gain joy. Not secular or that of the natural man but spiritual joy. No doubt there will come a time when we can trade stories personally to see what is true. I hope it's me because otherwise I might not have had to worry so much or work so hard.   

[cromwell]

True but Jerusalem will not stand in the end so there will be nothing to fight over any longer. Oh and your soul isn't lost yet! 

I've met and known many religious people,had a brother with ambitions of being a minister.....I was always rebellious though
Despite the fact I don't know you personally from your posts I believe you really do have what I would see as true Christian principles.

[T00ts]

True but Jerusalem will not stand in the end so there will be nothing to fight over any longer. Oh and your soul isn't lost yet! 

[cromwell]

He doesn't. He let's everyone behave the way they choose, that's the whole point of free will, but Jesus preached love not hate, peace not battles. The situation will only be given a certain amount of time before time will be called.

You misunderstand,that's not what I'm saying I said they say they all believe in the same God and will go as far as killing anyone who disputes their version of that God being the correct one.
In any event being an atheist I guess I'm destined for an endless stint in purgatory/hell or whatever..
Thing is Toots they don't believe in your Christ the Lord as they both fight over Jerusalem..

[T00ts]

I can understand Johns thinking on this,people who believe they are chosen other religions who believe they and only they and their path is right.

How many people have been murdered in pursuit and adherence in their surety of that belief?

So many say they believe in the same God but what sort of a god other than one with a twisted logic would see the carnage by those adhering to what they believe on the one true path?

He doesn't. He let's everyone behave the way they choose, that's the whole point of free will, but Jesus preached love not hate, peace not battles. The situation will only be given a certain amount of time before time will be called.

[cromwell]

I can understand Johns thinking on this,people who believe they are chosen other religions who believe they and only they and their path is right.

How many people have been murdered in pursuit and adherence in their surety of that belief?

So many say they believe in the same God but what sort of a god other than one with a twisted logic would see the carnage by those adhering to what they believe on the one true path?

[Sheepy]

I guess that didn't create the worldwide drama on behalf of either side then.

[johnofgwent]

It most probably doesn't help that an utter psychopath is in charge in Israel. Who knows no other way?

Probably not. But is he REALLY that different from his predecesors ?

I exist on this planet because a Tw** by the name of Nasser decided to up the ante.


In the following months Uncle Sam told Britain where it really stood in its "special" relationship namely when Uncle Sam shouts Jump we say How High.


The joviality that was the Suez crisis ended in 1956 and the men sent there fully expecting to die there including my father who expected to die in an airstrike on the protection be radar in Cyprus he was keeping my going in the heat came back sometime after Christmas 56 / New Year 57 and there's a bloody great spike in the birth rate in September and October 1957 and you need me to spell out how that came about (some momentum snowflakes probably DO)

As a young man I had to deal with the dogma of the left spewing bile on one side matched by the dogma on the right spewing back its own.

I actually REMEMBER Anwar Sadat who was Nasser's Right Hand Man kicking off a six day war and I remember him televised signing a peace deal with  Menachim Begin.


He signed away the whole f**king Sinai Peninsula and look where THAT got HIM

Sorry, I've had it up to here.

Time they were allowed to know each other to bits

I don't give a f**k any more

Bring it on.

Biden needs to learn a few home truths anyway

[Sheepy]

Generally speaking, the US (sorry I meant the Jewish Voices controlling the US Congress and Senate) target civilians with the Apache Helicopters they let a few nice Jewish boys fly now and again for a weekend jaunt, so it's hardly surprising the other side does the same.


Frankly, these two gave been at each others throats for millennia and each sends their siren voices wailing to our media, our universities and our government telling us how nasty the other side is.


I'm just a tad weary of the lies and bullshit.


We don't need Arab Oil any more, we aren't allowed to have cars. Screw thus, they each side blow the shit out of the other until uncle Sam goes Mano a Mano with MBS which is right where this is heading.

It most probably doesn't help that an utter psychopath is in charge in Israel. Who knows no other way?

[johnofgwent]

The Gazans / Iran proxies have been emboldened by the change in the USA government. They've discovered that a volley of 100 missiles can overwhelm the Iron Dome system and therefore a lot of people have been killed and injured.
They totally target civilians.

They've crossed a red line hitting Jerusalem and Tel Aviv and Israel may well have to put forces in on the ground in Gaza to take out the Hamas terrorists. That could be very expensive in lives of Israeli soldiers. It was last time.

Generally speaking, the US (sorry I meant the Jewish Voices controlling the US Congress and Senate) target civilians with the Apache Helicopters they let a few nice Jewish boys fly now and again for a weekend jaunt, so it's hardly surprising the other side does the same.


Frankly, these two gave been at each others throats for millennia and each sends their siren voices wailing to our media, our universities and our government telling us how nasty the other side is.


I'm just a tad weary of the lies and bullshit.


We don't need Arab Oil any more, we aren't allowed to have cars. Screw thus, they each side blow the shit out of the other until uncle Sam goes Mano a Mano with MBS which is right where this is heading.

[Sheepy]

One of these days there will come along a commentator who is totally fair and unbiased in this never ending conflict.
I won't hold my breath.

The people who make the choices for Israel have made them for you Barry.

[Sampanviking]

I'll let Melanie Phillips answer that from Jerusalem, since you have just repeated Adam Boulton's fatuous claim.

Instead, he made the fatuous claim that that the violence was a reaction to the "forcible eviction" from the Jerusalem district of Sheikh Jarrah of Palestinians who had "no property rights".

This is risible. Let's spell this out once again. Four Palestinian families are currently at risk of eviction in Sheikh Jarrah. [HIGHLIGHT]These Palestinians are the tenants of an Israeli organisation that owns these properties. They are threatened with eviction simply because  they are refusing to pay their rent.[/HIGHLIGHT]

They are not facing eviction because they are Arabs and the Jews want to replace Arab residents by Jews. Jews already own these properties, and have done so since the middle of the 19th century with only one break.

This was between 1948 and 1967 when Jordan illegally occupied this territory, expelled the Jews and sequestered their land. When Jerusalem was re-unified, the Jewish owners regained their properties and the Arab tenants signed an agreement confirming that the Jews were the rightful owners.

It was only after the current Arab residents refused to pay the rent and illegally expanded the properties that the Jewish owners initiated eviction proceedings. This is nothing other than a local rent dispute between landlord and tenant which has been cynically and wickedly twisted to serve the propaganda interests of the Palestinians.

It is extraordinary to see the credulous laziness with which much of the western media, along with a number of politicians, have swallowed and regurgitated this malevolent rubbish about the Palestinians' current onslaught against Israel.

Well you peak my professional interest with this as Tenants not paying rent is something I deal with all the time.
First of all, I have read now in various locations that the houses at the center of this issue were UN houses built specifically for displaced Palestinians, so there is an immediate question as to how they ended up being "owned" by Jewish Landlords.

Secondly for all the "Tenants" to refuse to pay rent all at the same time is quite remarkable. This suggest an underlying issue which has triggered this reaction. Typically this would be the failure to properly maintain and to allow the properties to fall into disrepair, and/or a sudden and very substantial increase in the rent.
All of the above are constructive evictions and are often used where tenants have secure tenancies which are difficult to end. Rather as it was in the UK when the backbone of rental was the old Assured Tenancy which could only be ended by a successful application using a Section 8 notice, which was before the introduction of the Shorthold Assured Tenancy which is easily ended by a Section 21 notice. Older tenancies were even more difficult to break.
So my professional antenna are telling me that there is some dirty work at foot in order to break Secure tenancies and move in Jewish Tenants instead, in properties that Jews should never have owned in the first place.

[Barry]

One of these days there will come along a commentator who is totally fair and unbiased in this never ending conflict.
I won't hold my breath.

[Sheepy]

When you can refute that they stopped paying rent, and that the government delayed process because of the sensitivity, I'll look forward to the link.
If you have a look at Al Jazeera you will see Pallywood are back in production.

I bet you never have noticed, just about every Israeli Government department and Military command has a name that could come right out of an Orwell novel.
Wait for it, it won't be long before, it will be, I have said so for years.