Food production in the UK at risk of moving overseas, warns industry

[papasmurf]

Is that all you've got? Calling everyone nasty?
You need a dose of real life.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-52660591

2013    9%
2020    4%

That's a drop of 5% since UC was introduced.

Coincidence and you have cherry picked the 5% without even looking at the context. It it you who needs a dose of real life. Basically you haven't got a clue about UC it has been a disaster, it is still not fully rolled out.
Iain Duncan Smith made the same mistake as you. He believed his own propaganda about there being a million "bone idle wasters," and getting them into work would pay for the implementation of UC, there weren't and it didn't.

Those whose lives have been made a lot worse by UC are mainly in work.

I am afraid whilst you keep posting like a pub professor and refuse to realise you are not only very ill informed you are very nastily prejudiced.
(I note you still have  not quantified or qualified the "bone idle wasters."

Before the 2008 crash there were only 40000 on long term unemployment benefit.
UC has caused more problems than it has solved. (Which is a pity because the problems with it are of the Tory governments and the DWPs own making.)

[Nick]

It is you who is not understanding where are you getting that 5% from please as I suspect you have cherry picked that with no context. (Not a newspaper reference please a link to ONS datasets with a time line.
The drop does not back up your frankly ill-informed prejudiced and nasty mindset.

Is that all you've got? Calling everyone nasty?
You need a dose of real life.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-52660591

2013    9%
2020    4%

That's a drop of 5% since UC was introduced.

[papasmurf]

And that is what you're not understanding. It was deliberately made difficult, the outcome was that unemployment fell by 5%: proving that they could have got a job any time.

It is you who is not understanding where are you getting that 5% from please as I suspect you have cherry picked that with no context. (Not a newspaper reference please a link to ONS datasets with a time line.
The drop does not back up your frankly ill-informed prejudiced and nasty mindset.

[Nick]

UC has been a disaster for many claimants due to the Tory doctrine based regulations and the usual DWP cock-ups and delays.

And that is what you're not understanding. It was deliberately made difficult, the outcome was that unemployment fell by 5%: proving that they could have got a job any time.

[papasmurf]

For who?

As quote is now working UC has been a disaster for many claimants due to the Tory doctrine based regulations and the usual DWP cock-ups and delays.

https://www.trusselltrust.org/what-we-do/research-advocacy/universal-credit-and-foodbank-use/
When Universal Credit goes live in an area, there is a demonstrable increase in demand in local Trussell Trust foodbanks. On average, 12 months after roll-out, food banks see a 52% increase in demand, compared to 13% in areas with Universal Credit for 3 months or less. This increase cannot be attributed to randomness and exists even after accounting for seasonal and other variations.
Benefit transitions, most likely due to people moving onto Universal Credit, are increasingly accounting for more referrals and are likely driving up need in areas of full Universal Credit roll-out. Waiting for the first payment is a key cause, while for many simply the act of moving over to a new system is causing hardship.

[Nick]

UC has been a disaster.

For who?

[papasmurf]

I'm the one who hasn't got a clue 😆 😆 😆.
Unemployment has dropped by 5%, UC has done exactly what the government wanted it to do: cause a six week delay in payments and force lazy bastards back into work. Job done, and if you can't see that then there is no hope for you.

Nick you really do not have clue. Especially with the furlough scheme hiding a lot of unemployment.
UC has been a disaster.
Can you quantify just how many to use your disgusting ill informed prejudiced nasty mindset "lazy bastards you think there are please?
I suggest you need to look at the unemployment data in full not just to do a Daily Heil journalist cherry pick.

https://www.ons.gov.uk/employmentandlabourmarket/peopleinwork/employmentandemployeetypes/bulletins/employmentintheuk/august2021

[Nick]

Nick your comments show how woefully out of touch you really are. (Seriously you don't have an (expletive deleted,) clue.)  UC which I agree with in principle has been a massive disaster due to the Tory doctrine attached to the administration and regulations, and the government's and the DWP's hostile attitude towards claimants.
The Tories refuse to make simple alterations to UC so would function a lot better and not leave people with no UC for weeks/months or in some cases longer. Getting into serious debt, needing to be referred to foodbanks and face eviction.

People have to comply with the Claimant Committment so frankly you sat on their arses claiming benefit is so far out of touch with the reality, you are coming very close to it being not even worth attempting to debate with you.
You need some serious re-education.

The drop in unemployment is due to the gig economy, a massive rise in spurious self-employment, and a rise in part time working.

I'm the one who hasn't got a clue 😆 😆 😆.
Unemployment has dropped by 5%, UC has done exactly what the government wanted it to do: cause a six week delay in payments and force lazy bastards back into work. Job done, and if you can't see that then there is no hope for you.

[papasmurf]

UC was brought in in 2013 and since then unemployment has dropped from 8% to less than 4%. That shows that a massive number of people where sat on their arses claiming benefits when they could have been working, a bit of a financial squeeze due to the change over and they started to work. Some on here who constantly slate the DWP obviously don't understand what the government's aim was. It worked though.

Nick your comments show how woefully out of touch you really are. (Seriously you don't have an (expletive deleted,) clue.)  UC which I agree with in principle has been a massive disaster due to the Tory doctrine attached to the administration and regulations, and the government's and the DWP's hostile attitude towards claimants.
The Tories refuse to make simple alterations to UC so would function a lot better and not leave people with no UC for weeks/months or in some cases longer. Getting into serious debt, needing to be referred to foodbanks and face eviction.

People have to comply with the Claimant Committment so frankly you sat on their arses claiming benefit is so far out of touch with the reality, you are coming very close to it being not even worth attempting to debate with you.
You need some serious re-education.

The drop in unemployment is due to the gig economy, a massive rise in spurious self-employment, and a rise in part time working.

[Nick]

Ah well I always thought and have posted over various forums that those who work hard make plenty of cash are free to spend it as they will (within the law) and good luck to them so long as they pay their dues.

There are however tax dodging scum who should be pursued,the difference is I don't lump them all together as the lowest common denominator as you do those on benefits.

UC was brought in in 2013 and since then unemployment has dropped from 8% to less than 4%. That shows that a massive number of people where sat on their arses claiming benefits when they could have been working, a bit of a financial squeeze due to the change over and they started to work. Some on here who constantly slate the DWP obviously don't understand what the government's aim was. It worked though.

[cromwell]

John, you talk about working for your self yet call out people as tax dodging scum/ make your mind up.

Ah well I always thought and have posted over various forums that those who work hard make plenty of cash are free to spend it as they will (within the law) and good luck to them so long as they pay their dues.

There are however tax dodging scum who should be pursued,the difference is I don't lump them all together as the lowest common denominator as you do those on benefits.

[johnofgwent]

John, you talk about working for your self yet call out people as tax dodging scum/ make your mind up.

You misunderstand. That is the take the BBC have.


My view has always been that of Lord Clyde, as per my sig, ever since I got the demand for £5 from Dennis Healey's rottweilers.

[papasmurf]

John, you talk about working for your self yet call out people as tax dodging scum/ make your mind up.

There are a lot of tax-dodging scum about.

[Nick]

My point was the BBC have until recently in every article of more than a few lines insisted IR35 and its effect on tax dodging scum who want to evade their responsibilities WAS a factor directly responsible for a shortfall in drivers.

John, you talk about working for your self yet call out people as tax dodging scum/ make your mind up.

[johnofgwent]

According to the link on driver shortage from the BBC, pay is not the major problem. Pay rises and bonuses to attract drivers back into work are frequently reported, and the link reports one driver claiming a 40% increase.   


The main gripe by drivers and the reasons for leaving and not recommending the job to others are reported as lack of overnight and rest facilities (as compared to those on mainland Europe), and the attitude of the public. 


I don't see JoG's argument on IR35. The likes of Uber drivers and Pimlico Plumbers have been clamouring to become employees to enjoy the benefits and have a boss look after HMRC collections. The only comment that could be construed as perhaps referring to that, reads:  The coronavirus pandemic, Brexit and tax changes have all contributed to a lack of qualified drivers. Industry bodies estimate there is a shortfall of about 100,000 workers...

My point was the BBC have until recently in every article of more than a few lines insisted IR35 and its effect on tax dodging scum who want to evade their responsibilities WAS a factor directly responsible for a shortfall in drivers.


That claim is bullshit for the reasons explained.


A number of people myself included had the BBC taken to task over this falsehood a few weeks ago


They are, however, still trying it on.


I agree with you that Uber drivers and many victims of the "gig" economy HAVE been clamouring to be employees and in fact nothing stops a driver entitled to be legally in business on their own account thanks to this case law from signing it away in order to get such "benefits" (holiday pay I presume) as may accrue to an  employee.


The Agencies Act of about 1983 put paid to people hired through companies like Manpower being able to take advantages of Derry and Tony's Fuckup. The case law allowing a driver to claim self employment requires they be hired directly by the client company, an intermediary negates the protection


My real point was the BBC are still trying to peddle the lie tax changes are responsible in some measure. They are not.