House of Horror Show

[Javert]

When you listen to phone- ins and the remain MPs, they all go on about the saving we were supposed to be making and how much would go to the NHS, as per the bus - and where is it? The idiots don't realise that that was promised when we left. We haven't @@@@ left yet. No interviewer host ever points that out to them.  :kikass:

I think they are pointing out that all of the forecasts, even the government's own forecasts, seem to indicate that we will have less money after leaving in the short, medium and long terms.  If you define long term as being several decades into the future, say 50 years, there is a small chance we might be better off depending what happens in the rest of the world, but in any case by then it will be impossible to prove.



If the UK was a private business, no company that wanted to stay in operation would take such a gamble.  Unfortunately the Conservatives seem to have stopped being the party of business and are now the party of Brexit.



This brings up an interesting point which is that nobody is talking about the Brexit party in recent days, but it's very clear that everything that's happening right now is entirely driven by the threat to the Tories posed by the Brexit party if they don't deliver Brexit.



Unfortunately for them, I suspect that threat will happen no matter what, because the Brexit party won't settle for anything other than no deal - even the hardest of hard deals will not satisfy them and they will still stand in the election I suspect.

[GerryT]

When you listen to phone- ins and the remain MPs, they all go on about the saving we were supposed to be making and how much would go to the NHS, as per the bus - and where is it? The idiots don't realise that that was promised when we left. We haven't @@@@ left yet. No interviewer host ever points that out to them.  :kikass:

The big red bus said you would see 350m a week that you pay to the EU coming back for the NHS. But what wasn't pointed out is the UK doesn't pay 350m a week. It pays roughtly 145m a week. Then you have to deduct from that the cost of setting up the 50 or so regulatory bodies, like eurathom etc.. that the UK NEEDS when it leaves. Then you deduct from that the additional cost for customs officials/police etc. Then deduct from that the cost of the fall in sterling, about 10% so far and another 10 when you leave. Then you deduct between 4% to 10% of UK GDP which is the expected hit due to the type brexit you take. Now what's left is the saving (if any) from leaving the UK. The reason interviewers don't bring it up is they know there is no saving from leaving the UK, it's a financial loss. If money is your reason for leaving then it doesn't stack up. You would be better focusing on "taking back control", but that's also another falsehood.

[T00ts]

Some weather man on the BBC as a surname of Fawkes, we should draft him in for the job. He has a glint in his eye when he tells us the temperature is dropping and rain is on the way.

 ::  :: Is he a remainer though.



(Cassie check the dog thread)

[Cassie]

I went out and they were ranting, I come back and they are still ranting. Roll on Nov 5th - anyone a Guy Faulkes descendant?

Some weather man on the BBC as a surname of Fawkes, we should draft him in for the job. He has a glint in his eye when he tells us the temperature is dropping and rain is on the way.

[T00ts]

When you listen to phone- ins and the remain MPs, they all go on about the saving we were supposed to be making and how much would go to the NHS, as per the bus - and where is it? The idiots don't realise that that was promised when we left. We haven't @@@@ left yet. No interviewer host ever points that out to them.  :kikass:

I went out and they were ranting, I come back and they are still ranting. Roll on Nov 5th - anyone a Guy Faulkes descendant?

[Cassie]

I see the big red bus marked leaving the EU has so far got 3 flat tyres, and a dodgy battery. The poor conductor keeps ringing the bell but it's not going anywhere until a mechanic arrives. They seem to be on strike.

When you listen to phone- ins and the remain MPs, they all go on about the saving we were supposed to be making and how much would go to the NHS, as per the bus - and where is it? The idiots don't realise that that was promised when we left. We haven't @@@@ left yet. No interviewer host ever points that out to them.  :kikass:

[Barry]

Surprise of the day: Anna Soubry will be voting against the Bill!  :fcplm:

[T00ts]

I'm not watching - have we left yet? Nearly left? No chance of leaving?

I see the big red bus marked leaving the EU has so far got 3 flat tyres, and a dodgy battery. The poor conductor keeps ringing the bell but it's not going anywhere until a mechanic arrives. They seem to be on strike.

[GerryT]

I tuned in again for a bit. One thing I'm getting is that many like to rant on about Northern Ireland because they do not understand more sophisticated matters pertaining to trade and the economy. They talk about Ireland because it is easy for them, as per they think people should this or should that, and they can make it up as they go along, whereas macro-economic forecasting is just out of their sphere understanding entirely, hence we are liable to be sold down the river with this distraction. I have not heard them even mention we are forbidden in setting our own trade policy with the world in this stitch-up. Sorry, I refuse to call it a deal because it is not. Deals are something where you stand to gain something.

You are gaining something. Hard brexit = major economic hit. Deal = less of an economic hit. Both don't improve your position but the deal is a gain on no deal.

[Baron von Lotsov]

I tuned in again for a bit. One thing I'm getting is that many like to rant on about Northern Ireland because they do not understand more sophisticated matters pertaining to trade and the economy. They talk about Ireland because it is easy for them, as per they think people should this or should that, and they can make it up as they go along, whereas macro-economic forecasting is just out of their sphere understanding entirely, hence we are liable to be sold down the river with this distraction. I have not heard them even mention we are forbidden in setting our own trade policy with the world in this stitch-up. Sorry, I refuse to call it a deal because it is not. Deals are something where you stand to gain something.

[Cassie]

I'm not watching - have we left yet? Nearly left? No chance of leaving?

[Cassie]

They're all moaning that there isn't long enough to scrutinise the deal and they feel legislation will be rushed through without much thought. They were  quite happy to push several bills and court cases through quickly. We know what you are up to, don't think we are stupid.

[Cassie]

We may actually thank him in the days to come as the only Brexit is a clean break from Brussels .In  stopping this remainers charter he may actually be doing us a favour .

Many leavers have waivered in recent weeks (self included ) as the 'House of horrors' has ground us down to the point where we will accept any form of leaving .Good god at one point last Saturday I was actually hoping the Boris deal would get the vote . I really must lay off the beer .



No deal is still the only deal on the table that gives us Brexit

Do you think Brexit will happen if this deal is not passed? I don't.

[Thomas]

Brexit was always going to be difficult because the leave factions in parliament are fractured in what they want, and I include Labour as a leave faction since until recently they just wanted their own version of Brexit.

totally disagree with you.



The issue is 80 % or thereabouts of that parliament stood on a ticket to brexit in their 2017 general election manifestos , got elected on that ticket , and around 77% of the current parliament are avowed remainers , many of who are reneging on the promises they were elected on.



Philip lee , mp for bracknell in hertfordshire is a perfect example of the duplicity of remainers in england.



Bracknell voted 54 % leave in 2016 , lee stood on a brexit ticket in 2017 and got 60 % of the vote for the tories , voted against brexit at nearly every opportunity afterwards , and a month or so back crossed the floor to the lib dems saying he doesnt want brexit and wont face his constituents to see if they agree with him.



Thats an example of why we are where we are.

and I include Labour as a leave faction since until recently they just wanted their own version of Brexit.

Im not sure i agree with this. Labour are all over the place on many things , but i dont think many people would say they are a leave faction.



Supporting some pie in the sky brexit in name only doesnt qualify you as a leave party.

Parliament is ultimately divided over the degree which the UK is going to sever it's ties to the EU and consequently how much freedom this government will have to reforge the country into their preferred image. This image appears to be one of reduced regulation, low tax, reduced workers rights, greater privitisation of public assets and services, and shifting trade away from the EU to the rest of the world.

i agree , so why are labour not supporting a general election to try and help sort things out?



If voters dont want the above , the tories and brexiters will be smashed and labour will romp home opposing it.



instead , the plan seems to be oppose everything to do with brexit going forward  , demand another referendum without implementing the first , and refuse to support a general election despite calling for one over the last two years.



In short ,the plan is to keep punting project fear , trying to change englands heart and minds over brexit while delying as long as possible , because labour know they are going to get humped at the next general election for being the party of anti democrats.

The government has succesfully portrayed those leave supporters who disagree with them as remainers and in doing so obfuscated what is actually going on.

No they havent. Th big story is parliament has successfully and anti demcratically so far managed to overturn the democratic referendum of 2016 they gave the people of the uk and gibraltar becasue they didnt like the result , and they are going to each pay for it politically at the next general election.



The idea so called leavers who are brexit in name only are being unfairly portrayed as remainers is a nonsense.



Laving the eu but remaining in the customs union is bollocks anyone with any sense can see through , indeed even tony blair and others said it takes away the only reason for brexiting which is freedom to do your own trade deals around the world.

[Findeton]

Exactly, in this case. He has broken the rules many times to get to the point where he can frustrate the process legitimately.

I can agree to that. :hattip