Care Homes

[Thomas]

What's wrong with dividing England in principle? I don't see how that could have any effect on Scot indy, in fact it would probably help..wouldn't it?

Nothing is wrong with it. Its nothing to do with me.



The point im making is how crazy some people minds actually are. They appear to think dividing engnland back into the danelaw or mercia or whatever is somehow going to stop scottish indy for some reason.



What you do in your country is your concern , just as what we do is ours , which is the point.



Personally i couldnt give a feck is brittany left France , bavaria germany , catalonia spain or northumbria england. Its none of my business , and i say good luck to people if thats what they want. It wont however make a blind bit of difference to my views on scotland. 8-)

It was just something that popped up on google.

Dont know dyno. Good luck to them if thats what they want . It doesnt make a blid bit of difference to me as i said.

Everything's interlinked, the forces of evil (basically the no campaign) rely on human fallibility to win and appealing to people's worst instincts...fear, uncertainty etc. I dunno. Just something to think about.

It is , but bringing the utopia of heaven on earth has to start somewhere , and thats by getting scottish indy.



 ::

My condolences for your old man mate.



That is very good work by the Scots govt and can only be commended.

:thup:



Its been a number of years now , but i think about him everyday.



He had fantastic care at the end , and i thank my lucky stars i won the lottery of life and was born in scotland. 8-)

[Borg Refinery]

I know mate. What i also notice is every time someone talks about scottish indy , someone else starts talking about dividing scotland , or even england , up into further pieces as though this is somehow going to spite us and stop indy in its tracks.



 ::

What's wrong with dividing England in principle? I don't see how that could have any effect on Scot indy, in fact it would probably help..wouldn't it?



I don't necessarily think it's a good idea to split England, the only movement is the Cornish one and that's not happening really. Do you think it's any good? I don't know.



Re the shetlands, I figured it was a bit like the Cornish movement ie a non-starter but a bit of gesturing to gain some more recognition. It was just something that popped up on google.

One thing at a time dynamis. I will worry about the good of mankind once i get independence , until then , its a sideshow im not interested in.

Everything's interlinked, the forces of evil (basically the no campaign) rely on human fallibility to win and appealing to people's worst instincts...fear, uncertainty etc. I dunno. Just something to think about.

social care in scotland has been devolved along with wider health since devolution began.



Unlike in england , social care is free at the point of use .My old man was in a BUPA private care home for many years until he sadly passed away , all free of direct charge.



Of course as we discussed further up the page , had labour got into power at holyrood , they wanted to bring scotland into line with the disaster you have in england and wales.





https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/may/07/scotland-lead-way-cradle-grave-care-uk-devolved-tax-increase#maincontent">https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/201 ... aincontent">https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/may/07/scotland-lead-way-cradle-grave-care-uk-devolved-tax-increase#maincontent



https://www.gov.scot/publications/health-social-care-delivery-plan/">https://www.gov.scot/publications/healt ... very-plan/">https://www.gov.scot/publications/health-social-care-delivery-plan/



https://www.gov.scot/policies/social-care/">https://www.gov.scot/policies/social-care/



https://www.gov.scot/news/strengthened-clinical-oversight-for-care-homes/">https://www.gov.scot/news/strengthened- ... are-homes/">https://www.gov.scot/news/strengthened-clinical-oversight-for-care-homes/



have a look and read for yourself many of the articles on how the care system differs amongst the yookay nations.







https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-30902552">https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-30902552

My condolences for your old man mate.



That is very good work by the Scots govt and can only be commended.

[Thomas]

I noticed something about an shetlands independence movement somewhere.

I know mate. What i also notice is every time someone talks about scottish indy , someone else starts talking about dividing scotland , or even england , up into further pieces as though this is somehow going to spite us and stop indy in its tracks.



 ::

Why should we settle for it? I know people say you can't change human nature..but what if that's not true?



Take my old man for example, he's a feckin nutcase (ex biker, not the hobbyist kind), now a lot of people who know him say he's one of the nicest people they know. I happen to be scared of his psychotic - and when I say psychotic I mean psychotic - side.



They say everyone has the capacity both for great good and to be a monster, given those extremes I've observed in people in real life, I live in hope that we can somehow change no matter how deluded, naive or loserish that may sound to anyone..

One thing at a time dynamis. I will worry about the good of mankind once i get independence , until then , its a sideshow im not interested in.

To return this briefly to care homes; what powers do the Scots govt have over care homes? There isn't a simple explanation anywhere..

social care in scotland has been devolved along with wider health since devolution began.



Unlike in england , social care is free at the point of use .My old man was in a BUPA private care home for many years until he sadly passed away , all free of direct charge.



Of course as we discussed further up the page , had labour got into power at holyrood , they wanted to bring scotland into line with the disaster you have in england and wales.

Scotland is refashioning social provision in the UK. Already the state provides free personal homecare for older people alongside free NHS prescriptions for all. With local councils and housing associations, it has begun building 30,000 social homes over a five-year period and, unlike England, it has abolished the sale of council houses to tenants. Under new legislation, it is moving to align health and social care through 31 integration authorities charged with delivering a £8.5bn budget tailored to local areas

[/b]



https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/may/07/scotland-lead-way-cradle-grave-care-uk-devolved-tax-increase#maincontent">https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/201 ... aincontent">https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/may/07/scotland-lead-way-cradle-grave-care-uk-devolved-tax-increase#maincontent



https://www.gov.scot/publications/health-social-care-delivery-plan/">https://www.gov.scot/publications/healt ... very-plan/">https://www.gov.scot/publications/health-social-care-delivery-plan/



https://www.gov.scot/policies/social-care/">https://www.gov.scot/policies/social-care/



https://www.gov.scot/news/strengthened-clinical-oversight-for-care-homes/">https://www.gov.scot/news/strengthened- ... are-homes/">https://www.gov.scot/news/strengthened-clinical-oversight-for-care-homes/



have a look and read for yourself many of the articles on how the care system differs amongst the yookay nations.

In Scotland, anyone who is over 65 is entitled to free personal care if they are assessed as needing help.



It is up to local authorities to set their criteria for who is eligible. Most have set it at substantial or critical level.



Personal care includes support to wash, dress and prepare meals. It does not, however, cover the cost of supplying the meals or for tasks such as help with shopping.



Anyone who needs care which requires a qualified nurse will also have that provided free by the NHS.

[/b]



https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-30902552">https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-30902552

[Borg Refinery]

Why what are you hinting at?

Honestly Thomas, the thought never crossed my mind.



I was simply interested, as I am in minority places, the same way you get places in the south east that stick out in a sea of blue, I was wondering if there's anything more to it than what I know and I figured the only person to ask would be you, given your encyclopedic knowledge of these things.



I don't believe I've ever suggested your oil belongs to us.



I noticed something about an shetlands independence movement somewhere.

Thats mankind for you dynamis , self centred and interested. Law of the jungle out there......kill or be killed.

Why should we settle for it? I know people say you can't change human nature..but what if that's not true?



Take my old man for example, he's a feckin nutcase (ex biker, not the hobbyist kind), now, and yet, a lot of people who know him say he's one of the nicest people they know - he's got both sides I've seen it - he's both of those things. I happen to be scared of his psychotic - and when I say psychotic I mean psychotic - side.



They say everyone has the capacity both for great good and to be a monster, given those extremes I've observed in people in real life, I live in hope that we can somehow change no matter how deluded, naive or loserish that may sound to anyone..

I dont think they are sell outs , they are looking after their own interests and who can blame them.



The point is the tories stab you from the front  , while labour do it from the back.



...and never confuse ramsay macdonald or the likes of gordon brown with myself or were our loyalties lay.........if you are born in a stable in their case , it doesnt make them a horse.

Fair enough, I can't disagree.







To return this briefly to care homes; what powers do the Scots govt have over care homes? There isn't a simple explanation anywhere..

[Thomas]

Oh yes the Moron.....Sorry unwanted mayor of Greater Manchester who scrambles to ape anything the Mayor of London does  :thdwn:

without a doubt cromwell.( from what little i know).



What i do know is how much he was laughed at  , not just outside the party , but inside labour when he tried his failed leadership bid which resulted in corbyn.



While he was at the heart of labours "privatising" the english nhs and social care system , when he went for leadership he tried to pull the wool over the party faithfulls eyes and make himself out to be against any privatisiation to sound great to them  , who of course saw through him.



Im just surprised labour think rebounding from corbynism to the blairites is a winning political formula.



Wonder if andy will ever get his ermine one day for services to the crown like his mate alistair darling , the former scottish labour republican.... ::



https://wingsoverscotland.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/ald1.png">

[Thomas]

What do you think explains the different voting patterns in Shetland and Western isles across several refs?

Why what are you hinting at?



Normally when such things are mentioned , its usually a prelude to something along the lines of england is going to keep shetland and all of scotland oil , which has of course been dealt with many a time.



Scottish government popualrity has risen over the years with the islanders , while westminsters has fallen. Of course the oil debate has been done to death as well , if the islands left scotland somehow ( however unlikely ) and remained with the ruk , in terms of oil , it has been well established so many times they wouldnt have any......the islands would have a twelve mile limit with no oil within scottish waters....

The reality could scarcely be any more distant from Tavish Scott's transparently inaccurate posturings. International maritime law (specifically the UN Convention on the Law of the Sea, or UNCLOS, which is signed and ratified by the UK) is extremely clear on what the situation would be with regard to Shetland and Orkney's ownership of North Sea Oil in the context of an independent Scotland – it wouldn't have any.



Under UNCLOS III, the islands would be regarded as an "enclave" residing wholly within Scotland's "Exclusive Economic Zone" (see the paragraph "Continental shelf"), and as such would only have the right to resources within a 12-mile radius of their coastline – of which, in terms of oil, there are basically none.

[/b]



Theres only around 70 000 people , barely more than the capacity of celtic park , inhabiting the western islands ,shetland and orkney , out of a popualtion of 5.5 million. Around 1.3%?



So im not really sure what explains any voting pattern in the islands , and im not really sure it matters.



The islands will leave the uk with scotland as an internal part of the scottish kingdom just as they came into the union with scotland in 1707.

A man responsible for so many deceptions..

A labour party unionist and british nationalist through and through.....

I agree you would be independent if not for that, it's iften those who claim to share your interests that turn out to be the biggest threat of all.

Without a doubt , scotland has seen through them though , and so has northern england hopefuly too.....

All politics is about self-interest, well most of it anyway, that's why we are in such a bad state all over the world..

Thats mankind for you dynamis , self centred and interested. Law of the jungle out there......kill or be killed.

You are right about the English left & right; as we saw going back to Ramsay McDonald and other 'national unity' initiatives they are sellouts and always have been historically.

I dont think they are sell outs , they are looking after their own interests and who can blame them.



The point is the tories stab you from the front  , while labour do it from the back.



...and never confuse ramsay macdonald or the likes of gordon brown with myself or where our loyalties lay.........if you are born in a stable in their case , it doesnt make them a horse.

Definitely.

 :thup:

[cromwell]

I agree.



Englands problems in care homes and the wider english health and social care services are cumulative problems dating back decades under both labour and conservative governments which is going to take something far more than a change in government at westminster to fix.



Im not saying you are suggesting otherwise , but labour as we know are the only alternative to the tories at westminster and although they like to sound good and promise the earth  on things like social care etc , we all know the blairite party that it has returned to under starmer is full of high profile shysters like andy burnham who epitomise labours duplicity.



When he was health minister under blair , burnham as im sure you know implemented all sort s of private market based reforms to bring competition into england s health and social care system , and as soon as labour lost power , he started vocally opposing the tories doing the very same thing he did when in power screaming about privatisation and all the rest.



It is disgracefull , but its something that wont change anytime soon under labour or conservative .



Thankfully we in scotland managed to kick labour out of power and have chosen not to go down the road england has in terms of social care .

Oh yes the Moron.....Sorry unwanted mayor of Greater Manchester who scrambles to ape anything the Mayor of London does  :thdwn:

[Borg Refinery]

You have just described scotland outside of the central belt where the majority live.

What do you think explains the different voting patterns in Shetland and Western isles across several refs?



Aoso how do you think the country estate thing around rural Scotland makes voting different?



It's an interesting question(well to me anyway, maybe I'm a boring bar steward..).

The 40 % deception was actually robin cooks brainchild from memory.

A man responsible for so many deceptions..

People like to big up the damage the tories and thatcher for example did to scotland. I also like the point out the even bigger damage labour have done to us . If it wasnt for labour , scotland would be a free and independent country right now and i for one wont ever forget that.

I agree you would be independent if not for that, it's iften those who claim to share your interests that turn out to be the biggest threat of all.

I have no time for any british party. The british left and right band together as soon as thier interests are threatened , as we saw when labour jumped into bed wae the tories to keep scotland. What you call the english left and right propaganda is merely two cheeks of the same arse to me.

All politics is about self-interest, well most of it anyway, that's why we are in such a bad state all over the world..



You are right about the English left & right; as we saw going back to Ramsay McDonald and other 'national unity' initiatives they are sellouts and always have been historically.

However from the english care home point of view  as  i was discussing , while you are right to criticise the tories , i am merely pointing out labours record is extremely poor as well and that in england under your dead end political system , nothing much will change under either red or blue tory.



Antoher issue that needs mentioned when ytou talk about the lack of funding for the english social care system is the amount of money being wasted by labours toxic PFI legacy under blair.  I read only last year it is costing the english £80 billion , or for every  6 pound spent on the english health system , £1 is spent on PFI debt.



Not to mention the £30 billion labours PFI is costing the scottish taxpayer.



Soemthing else to think about when lamenting the lack of funding for social care.

Definitely.

[Thomas]

I can't disagree with any of that tbh.



Somewhat serendipitously, and just fishing this out of my history from a few hours earlier:



https://wingsoverscotland.com/the-english-snp/">https://wingsoverscotland.com/the-english-snp/



(morayloon had revitalized the scotland section so it respurred my digging interests)



..Apparently there was also a huge surge of English members joining your party incl Stan Collymoore. I have remained off of any party's registers since at least 2015, but heck...even people who can't vote for you are joining the party. What does that say about the sorry state in England?



As the very astute wings fella points out, SNP members running in England was actually considered - but I agree it's probably not a good idea, and I guess some new party will need to be formed at some point in England.

I dont think the snp standing in england was ever seriously considered.



To what purpose?



It would have done nothing more than drained party funds , time and resources for no obvious benefit other than a few muppets feeling good about being liked.



The SNP arent there to be liked outside scotland. Who gives a feck if some ex footballer or foreigner likes them? They have one job , and one job only , to gain independence for scotland.



I said this to you before , its the only thing that unites the various groups within the party.

 My guess would be that there are folks with big country estates from England inhabiting them and the tiny populations mean they're overreptesented?

You have just described scotland outside of the central belt where the majority live.

But what I read about Labour manipulating the data in the 79 ref was shocking re the 40% mark.

The 40 % deception was actually robin cooks brainchild from memory.

I can more than understand your total antipathy towards Labour new & old given the deception they engaged in

People like to big up the damage the tories and thatcher for example did to scotland. I also like the point out the even bigger damage labour have done to us . If it wasnt for labour , scotland would be a free and independent country right now and i for one wont ever forget that.

What can I say? I am a subject of brainwashing by English left & right propaganda as much as anyone else, but it's important to see past that.

I have no time for any british party. The british left and right band together as soon as thier interests are threatened , as we saw when labour jumped into bed wae the tories to keep scotland. What you call the english left and right propaganda is merely two cheeks of the same arse to me.



However from the english care home point of view  as  i was discussing , while you are right to criticise the tories , i am merely pointing out labours record is extremely poor as well and that in england under your dead end political system , nothing much will change under either red or blue tory.



Antoher issue that needs mentioned when ytou talk about the lack of funding for the english social care system is the amount of money being wasted by labours toxic PFI legacy under blair.  I read only last year it is costing the english £80 billion , or for every  6 pound spent on the english health system , £1 is spent on PFI debt.



Not to mention the £30 billion labours PFI is costing the scottish taxpayer.



Soemthing else to think about when lamenting the lack of funding for social care.

[Borg Refinery]

I agree.



Englands problems in care homes and the wider english health and social care services are cumulative problems dating back decades under both labour and conservative governments which is going to take something far more than a change in government at westminster to fix.



Im not saying you are suggesting otherwise , but labour as we know are the only alternative to the tories at westminster and although they like to sound good and promise the earth  on things like social care etc , we all know the blairite party that it has returned to under starmer is full of high profile shysters like andy burnham who epitomise labours duplicity.



When he was health minister under blair , burnham as im sure you know implemented all sort s of private market based reforms to bring competition into england s health and social care system , and as soon as labour lost power , he started vocally opposing the tories doing the very same thing he did when in power screaming about privatisation and all the rest.



It is disgracefull , but its something that wont change anytime soon under labour or conservative .



Thankfully we in scotland managed to kick labour out of power and have chosen not to go down the road england has in terms of social care .

I can't disagree with any of that tbh.



Somewhat serendipitously, and just fishing this out of my history from a few hours earlier:



https://wingsoverscotland.com/the-english-snp/">https://wingsoverscotland.com/the-english-snp/



(morayloon had revitalized the scotland section so it respurred my digging interests)



..Apparently there was also a huge surge of English members joining your party incl Stan Collymoore. I have remained off of any party's registers since at least 2015, but heck...even people who can't vote for you are joining the party. What does that say about the sorry state in England?



As the very astute wings fella points out, SNP members running in England was actually considered - but I agree it's probably not a good idea, and I guess some new party will need to be formed at some point in England.



The corrupt "independent" group with Chuka and Blairite Labiur defecters was only ever a qideshow.



Incidentally (and as morayloon had posted earlier), I had a deeper look into the '79 referendum because I always found the outlaying islands' voting choices interesting, they voted out in the first EU ref and seem to vote the opposite way of the majority. My guess would be that there are folks with big country estates from England inhabiting them and the tiny populations mean they're overreptesented?



But what I read about Labour manipulating the data in the 79 ref was shocking re the 40% mark. I can more than understand your total antipathy towards Labour new & old given the deception they engaged in. A lot of people prefer to point out 'old labour's' role in NI was arguably more brutal than the Tories as well...



What can I say? I am a subject of brainwashing by English left & right propaganda as much as anyone else, but it's important to see past that.

[Thomas]

Remember when scottish labour were telling us in scotland this........

If you want to know what a future Labour government at Westminster might look like, the leader of the party in Scotland, Johann Lamont, has given the game away.



When Lamont finally explained what Scottish Labour stands for it turns out to be ending universal benefits, cutting apprenticeships, fewer university places, making older people pay for care and unfreezing council tax.

[/b]



http://www.aworldtowin.net/blog/midwinter-sends-scottish-labour-into.html">http://www.aworldtowin.net/blog/midwint ... -into.html">http://www.aworldtowin.net/blog/midwinter-sends-scottish-labour-into.html

The day that Scottish Labour died

[/b]

 Yesterday Johann Lamont gave the Scottish Parliament one of her something-for-nothing speeches.



There was something for Ed Balls, Shadow Chancellor, and nothing much for the comfort of Scottish Labour.

[/b]

personal care in old age: As of this week, these are all, it seems, mere luxuries. Ms Lamont seemed to say that these things had not been earned.

[/b]



https://www.heraldscotland.com/news/13074875.the-day-that-scottish-labour-died/">https://www.heraldscotland.com/news/130 ... bour-died/">https://www.heraldscotland.com/news/13074875.the-day-that-scottish-labour-died/





A brief reminder of how those daft barstewards in labour tried to sell us the same shite they sold england and got their arses kicked i the process , so much so they are down to 18 % of the vote in fourth place.



Remember this was all pre corbyn  , much to the annoyance of those trying to sell starmer as the new labour dream and put labours faults at the feet of corbyn.



No thankyou.

[Thomas]

https://www.yorkpress.co.uk/news/national/18500353.care-home-residents-hit-coronavirus-bill-providers-struggle---charity/">https://www.yorkpress.co.uk/news/nation ... --charity/">https://www.yorkpress.co.uk/news/national/18500353.care-home-residents-hit-coronavirus-bill-providers-struggle---charity/



That's really bad. As I showed prev., the govt is putting more funding into fruit picking than it is care home groups.



This is pretty disgraceful

I agree.



Englands problems in care homes and the wider english health and social care services are cumulative problems dating back decades under both labour and conservative governments which is going to take something far more than a change in government at westminster to fix.



Im not saying you are suggesting otherwise , but labour as we know are the only alternative to the tories at westminster and although they like to sound good and promise the earth  on things like social care etc , we all know the blairite party that it has returned to under starmer is full of high profile shysters like andy burnham who epitomise labours duplicity.



When he was health minister under blair , burnham as im sure you know implemented all sort s of private market based reforms to bring competition into england s health and social care system , and as soon as labour lost power , he started vocally opposing the tories doing the very same thing he did when in power screaming about privatisation and all the rest.



It is disgracefull , but its something that wont change anytime soon under labour or conservative .



Thankfully we in scotland managed to kick labour out of power and have chosen not to go down the road england has in terms of social care .

[Borg Refinery]

Care home residents hit with 'coronavirus bill' as providers struggle – charity



Care home residents are being asked to pay a "coronavirus bill" of more than £100 a week on top of existing fees to help social care providers stay afloat, a charity said.



Older people who pay for their care home fees are telling Age UK they are being presented with a "steep and unexpected" additional sum by their provider, amid rising staffing and personal protective equipment (PPE) costs.



The charity has received calls to its advice line from self-funders saying they are being asked to pay an extra 15% per week, which amounts to an extra bill of £127.65 based on the average weekly fee of £851.

https://www.yorkpress.co.uk/news/national/18500353.care-home-residents-hit-coronavirus-bill-providers-struggle---charity/">https://www.yorkpress.co.uk/news/nation ... --charity/">https://www.yorkpress.co.uk/news/national/18500353.care-home-residents-hit-coronavirus-bill-providers-struggle---charity/



That's really bad. As I showed prev., the govt is putting more funding into fruit picking than it is care home groups.



This is pretty disgraceful

[Barry]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-52912538https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-52912538">//https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-52912538https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-52912538

Large numbers of staff could have been unknowingly spreading coronavirus through care homes, according to the UK's largest charitable care home provider.



Data from MHA shows 42% of its staff members who recently tested positive were not displaying symptoms.



Nearly 45% of residents who had a positive test were also asymptomatic.



MHA operates in England, Scotland and Wales and has fully tested staff and residents in 86 of its 90 homes so far.

As it is mostly impossible to say who infected who, or when, people can use care homes as a stick to beat whoever they want. When actually, no-one is to blame but the microbe.

[T00ts]

Great and useful result, then.

But on the topic of care homes: if many of them are private companies, and not part of the NHS or state welfare system, why is the government being blamed for not supplying PPE and other gear which, after all, surely should be the responsibility of the care home owners to provide...?

I understood that private homes had 2 problems with PPE. 1) Orders they had were not delivered because the NHS had commandeered everything, 2) Once PPE was available the price escalated rapidly.