The Great British Withdrawal

[B0ycey]

You are completely clueless, as others have observed.



The lockdown was flouted by so many people (and businesses) leading to the high case numbers. It was very, very hard to enforce it at all - and many figures in govt themselves ignored it.



You are arguing with an incontrovertible fact, but please continue... you carry on digging and planting dynamite with your shovel.

Whether people broke the law is irrelevant. They closed down the economy and that was quite easily done (like one sentence at a briefing). Yet they have still have to open the economy up. And we will see just how easy that will be by GDP figures returning to pre-lockdown levels.

[Borg Refinery]

Are you for real?

You are completely clueless, as others have observed.



The lockdown was flouted by so many people (and businesses) leading to the high case numbers. It was very, very hard to enforce it at all - and many figures in govt themselves ignored it.



You are arguing with an incontrovertible fact, but please continue... you carry on digging and planting dynamite with your shovel.

[B0ycey]

Anyone with 20k spare in cash is probably not going to be impacted a great deal by lockdown. It's those who struggle to raise £20 at the end of the week who are going to be in serious trouble when the results of all this come home to roost. Negative interest rates won't mean a great deal if you have feck all to begin with.

Well I agree with the sentiment, but what about the knock on effect? That is those who only have £20 might not be impacted by a negative interest rate, but they might need finance to buy a car or a home or just to borrow to cover a repair. This isn't an endorsement for the banking institution but that it is part of the function of how we all live. Break the system and that £20 won't even buy you a pint. The alternative is Communism. That is sharing and working as a collective for society as a whole and without the need for an exchange medium. But there isn't an appetite for that and even Marx says Socialism must come first.

[papasmurf]

 It's those who struggle to raise £20 at the end of the week who are going to be in serious trouble

That is currently 14 million people.

[DeppityDawg]

Anyone with 20k or significantly more wkll just move it abroad to find a interest rate. That alone is bad for our banking institutions. But I suspect those with just a few thousand might just risk it - especially if the reason was to keep it as savings. Because who wants to save a loss?

Anyone with 20k spare in cash is probably not going to be impacted a great deal by lockdown. It's those who struggle to raise £20 at the end of the week who are going to be in serious trouble when the results of all this come home to roost. Negative interest rates won't mean a great deal if you have feck all to begin with.

[B0ycey]

Where do you come up with this stuff? Of course it isn't, not at all, it didn't really properly shut down which is why we have so many more cases than we should have.







No that's the easy bit.



The hard bit is returning to growth and stopping biz from going bust.

Are you for real? What is lockdown if it isn't shutting everything down? And as of yet, there is no plan to open up the service sector - our biggest area in GDP, because to do so you basically have to contradict the message you sent out to send us indoors to begin with.

[Borg Refinery]

Shutting the economy down is easy.

Where do you come up with this stuff? Of course it isn't, not at all, it didn't really properly shut down which is why we have so many more cases than we should have.

Opening it up again is f**king impossible.

No that's the easy bit.



The hard bit is returning to growth and stopping biz from going bust.

[B0ycey]

I'd much rather receive positive interest on my savings than pay the bank but if negative interest is introduced I can't imagine it lasting long so I'd just weather the storm. Some accounts have benefits for people who don't take money out, and in the long run losing those benefits might cost more than enduring a period of negative interest.

How do you think the government is going to pay for their Covid response? I am not talking about the billions of pound handed out but the interest on bonds? If they plan on having a negative interest it is so they do not have to cut services and that line of thinkinh is something that isn't going to end any time soon. I doubt in both our life times we will see interest rates go above 1% now. So that has an impact. Because banks rely on savings for their fractional reserve and people only have savings to earn interest. You might be happy to pay your bank to hold your money, but I doubt many do. Those with a significant holdings will look abroad and those with a bit will put it under their beds. Because say paying 1% annun on a thousand pounds still means that you pay the bank a hundred quid in ten years. Not to mention unemployment too.



Shutting the economy down is easy. Opening it up again is fucking impossible.

[Hyperduck Quack Quack]

Anyone with 20k or significantly more wkll just move it abroad to find a interest rate. That alone is bad for our banking institutions. But I suspect those with just a few thousand might just risk it - especially if the reason was to keep it as savings. Because who wants to save a loss?

I'd much rather receive positive interest on my savings than pay the bank but if negative interest is introduced I can't imagine it lasting long so I'd just weather the storm. Some accounts have benefits for people who don't take money out, and in the long run losing those benefits might cost more than enduring a period of negative interest.

[B0ycey]

The problem is that if all the banks charge you to look after your money, you'll have no choice and paying the 'negative interest' would probably be cheaper than installing a safe under your floor, surveillance cameras and a sophisticated alarm system so that you can keep £20,000 of banknotes at home!

Anyone with 20k or significantly more wkll just move it abroad to find a interest rate. That alone is bad for our banking institutions. But I suspect those with just a few thousand might just risk it - especially if the reason was to keep it as savings. Because who wants to save a loss?

[Hyperduck Quack Quack]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-52772950">//https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-52772950



So the Bank of England are looking at Negative Interest to pay for the Covid response. Meaning you will pay the banks to keep your money with them. If they think this is a good idea then they clearly have forgot what happened to Northern Rock in 2008.



We really do have clowns running government and we haven't even seen anything yet I suspect. Covid19 is the single biggest act of self harm in political history and I can only see the nail in the coffin for Capitalism now.

The problem is that if all the banks charge you to look after your money, you'll have no choice and paying the 'negative interest' would probably be cheaper than installing a safe under your floor, surveillance cameras and a sophisticated alarm system so that you can keep £20,000 of banknotes at home!  Anyway, right now I wad of banknotes is more of a health hazard than a bag of dog-poo.

[Borchester]

I bet you've already got yours stashed under the mattress anyway, you daft auld coot  ::  ::  ::

Don't. Some young buggers have just cloned my card and taken a couple of ton out. I am still in an advanced state of the palpitations. So yes, for the foreseeable future I will be using cash.



Actually, it is only a couple of hundred quid and I can live with that. But my lad (the computer nerd) has taken it as licence to go on and on about cyber fraud (or maybe cybermen) etc etc. He is a fine lad, but once he starts on these electric adding machines he could bore the arse off a wooden Indian.

[DeppityDawg]

True, but that is pretty much what I said. The insurance companies, pension funds, banks etc have to invest their funds in approved assets. But much of these are government stock which are offering negative interest. So they money markets are currently getting burned, but that has always been the cast for anyone with a bank account.

I bet you've already got yours stashed under the mattress anyway, you daft auld coot  ::  ::  ::

[Borchester]

Not quite.



It is a legal requirement for insurance companies, pension funds and banks etc to keep their assets in certain approved investments. And certain quota's on each type are in place.



So they are only allowed to by a certain % of gold.

A certain % of stocks.

A certain % to be kept in cash.



Predictably a certain % of their assets and legally required reserves must be kept in government bonds.

So even though this negative returning investment costs them money, they still have to do it.



It is by no means always a volunatery decision on thier part.

Not a choce they necessarily make on the basis of safety or economic prudence.

True, but that is pretty much what I said. The insurance companies, pension funds, banks etc have to invest their funds in approved assets. But much of these are government stock which are offering negative interest. So they money markets are currently getting burned, but that has always been the cast for anyone with a bank account.

[B0ycey]

Its another signal that will escape most peoples attention.

 :thup: Indeed.