Peter Hitchens - Major News from Japan. Not many interested.

[Hyperduck Quack Quack]

. . .Btw, its not a surprise your sarky comments were completely wasted on certain posters. Use sarcasm, irony or humour at your own peril ::

Surely that can't be the case! I've always been treated with utmost civility and politeness on here by people who disagree with me ::

[B0ycey]

The problem is there are more than enough idiots to make a spike in Covid-19 cases inevitable.

It is inevitable, but perhaps not for the reasons you think. That is any losing of policy increases contact and as such cases - so at some point all nations will have a spike in cases in regards to their original figures and those who have the most cases today will have more wriggle room in the future. The idiots are only following advice. That is, they perhaps shouldn't do what they are doing but do anyway as this is a problem with a new freedom being exploited and this phenomenon isn't unique to the UK. Also they only risk their own health if you protect yourself to the risk you are prepared to take. Which is basically what Japan has done. They have had experience with this before with the other outbreaks so people know how to behave and have the policy that it is up to you to protect yourself and they do. Can we do likewise? Sure, because we have. But it requires coherent advice which unfortunately the Tories seem incapable of doing.

[Javert]

The problem is there are more than enough idiots to make a spike in Covid-19 cases inevitable.

Despite being warmed there is no lifeguard cover and to stay away from Cornish beaches, over last week end there have been two deaths at sea, (probably a third if they cark it in hospital) and 412, repeat 412 incidents in the sea that required brave local people to sort out.

Yes - but they had to be instructed to do it whereas the Japanese do it by nature already - it's normal for them.



Maybe you are right and the Culture shift in UK people will somehow be permanent or lasting to keep a long distance, not shake hands, not hug strangers or minor acquaintances  and so on.  Time will tell but I have some doubts about it.

[papasmurf]

 by and large, the UK has adhered to the rules far better than I would have assumed before this began.

The problem is there are more than enough idiots to make a spike in Covid-19 cases inevitable.

Despite being warmed there is no lifeguard cover and to stay away from Cornish beaches, over last week end there have been two deaths at sea, (probably a third if they cark it in hospital) and 412, repeat 412 incidents in the sea that required brave local people to sort out.

[B0ycey]

That being the case, I'm not sure what we can learn, unless we are proposing that the UK population will suddenly all start behaving like the Japanese.

That's a bit unfair. Sure you might get the odd idiot who wants to test his eyesight with a drive, but by and large, the UK has adhered to the rules far better than I would have assumed before this began. And has proven that in terms of health will by and large follow what they are asked. And if that is to be less affectionate, I know plenty who would follow the Japanese way by preferred choice - and very few who wouldn't.

[Javert]

This actually was reported as I saw a couple of stories about it over the weekend.  



I agree that it's interesting, but I'm not sure how it translates given that our own government appeared to judge that UK people are incapable of following any kind of social distancing rules long term without being given nursery school level orders and police fines, and that this is mainly down to cultural differences.



That being the case, I'm not sure what we can learn, unless we are proposing that the UK population will suddenly all start behaving like the Japanese.



As said above, we can't know for sure for long time, but if you've been to Japan or observed Japanese culter at all, this appears to confirm that keeping your physical distance from people is a good way to reduce risk from such infections.

[DeppityDawg]

https://hitchensblog.mailonsunday.co.uk/2020/05/major-news-from-japan-not-many-interested.html">https://hitchensblog.mailonsunday.co.uk ... ested.html">https://hitchensblog.mailonsunday.co.uk/2020/05/major-news-from-japan-not-many-interested.html



Because I'm a horribly anglo-left-wing zealot, one of my favourite columnists happens to be Peter Hitchens; known for his extreme left wing liberal views in the daily mail.



Anyway it's a great article, as usual this guy doesn't listen to any mainstream narrative rubbish one way or the other and makes up his own mind. It shows that lockdown, or no lockdown isn't what causes high or low death rates - the reason why Japan did relatively well is probably due to their socially disciplined culture. They actually work collectively for the common good - in whatever way that may be.



That's my take on it anyway..

Its a good article. As has been said, until the last horse crosses the line, we won't know the result.



Btw, its not a surprise your sarky comments were completely wasted on certain posters. Use sarcasm, irony or humour at your own peril ::

[Nalaar]

The Japanese are an obedient nation, the wearing of face masks have been common for years, and they are also a very clean nation.

(You need a training course to use a Japanese toilet.) They also do not shake hand and hug and kiss each other.

The government has also had "big data" in place since the Tsunami and nuclear disaster. They can track and trace quickly for a variety of disasters.

It is interesting in seeing how Collective vs Individualistic societies respond, a pandemic may be the perfect test bed for that, however other factors (virus strain, genetic resistance etc)  muddy the water somewhat.

[papasmurf]

It's complex, but I just thought it was worth posting, even if I attract a load of flak from all sides.

I watch NHK TV on a regular basis, the news and the in depth science programs. I doubt it would be possible for the UK to implement "big data."

[Borg Refinery]

But yeah the result is interesting, IMHO the important point is that an 'official' lockdown in a highly individualistic western nation can potentially force people to do the opposite, so having a negative effect.



Sometimes a gentle 'nudge' is more effective than a hard shove.



It worked in Japan; we tried the gentle nudge approach here but no one seemed to listen; they took it very seriously in Japan - their culture is more collective and social adherence seems to be a virtue.



You can argue that's very 'sheeplike', and that is also a valid point...



It's complex, but I just thought it was worth posting, even if I attract a load of flak from all sides.

[papasmurf]

Yeah I would consider Peter Hitchens to be quite left wing, unless i am very much mistaken.



As for the article, a remarkable result like what they seem to of had in Japan is worthy of much investigation, though it is likely this will have to pass before we get round to any of that.,

The Japanese are an obedient nation, the wearing of face masks have been common for years, and they are also a very clean nation.

(You need a training course to use a Japanese toilet.) They also do not shake hand and hug and kiss each other.

The government has also had "big data" in place since the Tsunami and nuclear disaster. They can track and trace quickly for a variety of disasters.

[Borg Refinery]

The comment was sarcy, as a certain person on here keeps accusing me of being a rabid left wing zealot.  :-P

[Nalaar]

Yeah I would consider Peter Hitchens to be quite right wing, unless i am very much mistaken.



As for the article, a remarkable result like what they seem to of had in Japan is worthy of much investigation, though it is likely this will have to pass before we get round to any of that.,



Edit - Posted Left instead of Right...

[papasmurf]

Because I'm a horribly anglo-left-wing zealot, one of my favourite columnists happens to be Peter Hitchens; known for his extreme left wing liberal views in the daily mail.

Peter Hitchens left wing? He is a rabid right winger.

[Borg Refinery]

https://hitchensblog.mailonsunday.co.uk/2020/05/major-news-from-japan-not-many-interested.html">https://hitchensblog.mailonsunday.co.uk ... ested.html">https://hitchensblog.mailonsunday.co.uk/2020/05/major-news-from-japan-not-many-interested.html



Because I'm a horribly anglo-left-wing zealot, one of my favourite columnists happens to be Peter Hitchens; known for his extreme left wing liberal views in the daily mail.



Anyway it's a great article, as usual this guy doesn't listen to any mainstream narrative rubbish one way or the other and makes up his own mind. It shows that lockdown, or no lockdown isn't what causes high or low death rates - the reason why Japan did relatively well is probably due to their socially disciplined culture. They actually work collectively for the common good - in whatever way that may be.



That's my take on it anyway..