Ex-MI6 (and probable Bond villain) Head, Dearlove, says C19 made in Chinese Lab

[Borg Refinery]

And now debunk of the OP.

https://fullfact.org/health/richard-dearlove-coronavirus-claims/

TLDR

The idea the virus is artificial is the personal (and fringe) view of one of the authors of the report and not the conclusion of the report.  The scientific consensus is the virus is naturally occuring.

👍🖖 That's OP debunked then, I guess.

We can therefore conclude that the Bond Villain guy is simply trying to push theories that benefit him and his pals financially...

[BeElBeeBub]

And now debunk of the OP.

https://fullfact.org/health/richard-dearlove-coronavirus-claims/

TLDR

The idea the virus is artificial is the personal (and fringe) view of one of the authors of the report and not the conclusion of the report.  The scientific consensus is the virus is naturally occuring.

[BeElBeeBub]

Counter argument to the OP report



https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/jun/09/conspiracies-covid-19-lab-false-pandemic">https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... e-pandemic">https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/jun/09/conspiracies-covid-19-lab-false-pandemic

[BeElBeeBub]

Okay fair enough. But I don't think we should stop asking awkward questions.

absolutely.  Mind you "I'm just asking questions" is pretty much the mantra of every tinfoil hatter tracking down lizard people and the Illuminati!



In all seriousness, it's valid to ask if the virus was man made, but so far the overwhelming evidence seems to be it isn't.  We have one in reviewed paper which is way to technical for any of us and a bunch of other evidence pointing the opposite way.

We are, after all, a bunch of a-holes with an opinion on a forum and not polluticians with any power.

That we are.

[Sampanviking]

Which she caught after visiting Wuhan. Showing it was in Wuhan even earlier than the Chinese admitted.

https://www.theweek.co.uk/coronavirus/106933/french-athlete-caught-coronavirus-in-october">//https://www.theweek.co.uk/coronavirus/106933/french-athlete-caught-coronavirus-in-october

So why did only the French Athletes get sick? - why not loads of cases in loads of teams?

They started showing signs of the sickness while in Wuhan, which suggests to me, based on the 14 day incubation period, that they already had the infection before they arrived.

[Barry]

On top of that, the first documented case of Covid 19 on the record, is a French Woman called Elodie Clouvel; an athlete who along with several other French athletes in her touring group, fell ill in October 2019.

Which she caught after visiting Wuhan. Showing it was in Wuhan even earlier than the Chinese admitted.

https://www.theweek.co.uk/coronavirus/106933/french-athlete-caught-coronavirus-in-october">//https://www.theweek.co.uk/coronavirus/106933/french-athlete-caught-coronavirus-in-october

[Sampanviking]

I think given the new cold war reality being led by the US against China, I will take any such allegation with increasingly large doses of salt.



The number one question of course is what would China; the worlds leading global exporter, gain from releasing a "bio weapon" whose main attribute is to close down global trade?

Such a "bio weapon" seems more like a Protectionists dream and so surely it would make far more sense to look at leading Protectionist nations as those who would view such an outcome a as a benefit to them.



If China had deployed such a bio- weapon in the first place why on earth would they deploy it on their own territory? The answer often given " to make them look like a victim" is frankly farcical. It would make far more sense to deploy it in say the slums of Mumbai or Lagos and simply say it nothing to do with us.



The other claim is that it was an accident. Well if true, and it came from the Wuhan Bio Lab; a national level facility that answers to the very top, then the ruthlessly efficient shut down of Wuhan would have happened straight away at that point and containment achieved.



On top of that, the first documented case of Covid 19 on the record, is a French Woman called Elodie Clouvel; an athlete who along with several other French athletes in her touring group, fell ill in October 2019.



I suspect that this Deerlove supported report will prove to be just another dodgy dossier.



The underlying truth of today is that China is replacing the USA as the number one economy and therefore eventually number one world power and the USA does not like it one bit. Anything that calls into question the USA's exceptionalism and "God Given" right to rule the world will be resisted by it, tooth and nail. It will not be gracious, magnanimous or clean.

[Borg Refinery]

irrelevant to where we are now, not irrelevant

no it's not, apologies if it seemed that way.  



It was an observation that some people seem very keen on this theory.  I'm not sure what it gets us - my BiL is very keen on this and seems to think that finding the answer will solve the problems we have now, but cannot articulate how.



Let's say tomorrow Xi goes on tell, comes clean and admits they were fiddling around with bat viruses and things got out of hand and it was 100% their fault, they are sorry.



Could we end lockdown? stop looking for a vaccine? could pubs open?



Afterwards it might help us pressure China into changing things so it doesn't happen again. It would certainly help unite countries against China so they could apply pressure in a myriad of areas - governance, south china seas, trade, human rights etc.



If your house is on fire, knowing who started it doesn't help you put the flames out.





I did.  It's a possibility that they are holding onto a vaccine so it doesn't look too suspicious.  However, why holding on so long?  CV's effects on the world economy are blowing back on China as badly as anywhere.  It is suppressing demand in all their markets simultaneously as well as requiring drastic measures to contain back home.



Ultimately you will never be able to stop the conspiracy theories.

Okay fair enough. But I don't think we should stop asking awkward questions.



We are, after all, a bunch of a-holes with an opinion on a forum and not polluticians with any power.

[BeElBeeBub]

China will never admit to any culpability in relation to negligence regarding the virus.

What each country in the world will have to consider is to calculate the economic damage and send them a large bill.

There's no need to make war over this. But compensation will have to be paid if they are to blame.

1. Which "court" will you take china to over the compensation you think they owe



2. How will you make china pay this?



It's a well and good sending them a bill, but getting them to pay is another matter.

[papasmurf]

China will never admit to any culpability in relation to negligence regarding the virus.

What each country in the world will have to consider is to calculate the economic damage and send them a large bill.

There's no need to make war over this. But compensation will have to be paid if they are to blame.

It took decades for the British government to "confess," about cock-ups by Porton Down, America has had numerous similar problems as has France and many other countries.

Basically you can't trust ANY government.

[Barry]

China will never admit to any culpability in relation to negligence regarding the virus.

What each country in the world will have to consider is to calculate the economic damage and send them a large bill.

There's no need to make war over this. But compensation will have to be paid if they are to blame.

[BeElBeeBub]

Huh?



It's irrelevant if China have been modifying viruses?

irrelevant to where we are now, not irrelevant

If that accusation is aimed at me, then you are on the wrong planet sonny.

no it's not, apologies if it seemed that way.  



It was an observation that some people seem very keen on this theory.  I'm not sure what it gets us - my BiL is very keen on this and seems to think that finding the answer will solve the problems we have now, but cannot articulate how.



Let's say tomorrow Xi goes on tell, comes clean and admits they were fiddling around with bat viruses and things got out of hand and it was 100% their fault, they are sorry.



Could we end lockdown? stop looking for a vaccine? could pubs open?



Afterwards it might help us pressure China into changing things so it doesn't happen again. It would certainly help unite countries against China so they could apply pressure in a myriad of areas - governance, south china seas, trade, human rights etc.



If your house is on fire, knowing who started it doesn't help you put the flames out.

You didn't even consider the probability that mysteriously 'finding' a vaccine too quickly.. is virtually an admission of guilt?

I did.  It's a possibility that they are holding onto a vaccine so it doesn't look too suspicious.  However, why holding on so long?  CV's effects on the world economy are blowing back on China as badly as anywhere.  It is suppressing demand in all their markets simultaneously as well as requiring drastic measures to contain back home.



Ultimately you will never be able to stop the conspiracy theories.

[papasmurf]

Well because it's in the torygraph it'll always be bollocks to you,

If it were in ANY newspaper it would  be bollocks to me. IF there is ever a link to origin of peer reviewed research it would have some credibility.

[papasmurf]

If someone came up with some mad theory that Boris had in fact manufactured  covid 19

All that Boris can manufacture is bullshine, lies and waffle.

[DeppityDawg]

It's irrelevant at this point if CV started when someone ate a bat kebab, tripped over a pangolin or it was cooked up by President Xi himself in his bathroom.

The most newsworthy aspect of this is that it appears to have caused a mild sense of humour to break out with Beelzebub  ::



If it hasn't caused Beelbeeb to break his calculator out and start feverishly crunching numbers then it probably isn't worth considering