Infamy, Infamy: Tory rebels want T May led Brexit Uprising vs Boris's EU WA Plan

[Thomas]

Well I guess they just cannot get the message Thomas. the Labour party are not wanted anywhere by anyone, The Scots have proved they are in a way better position without them the English are in the middle of making changes without them and the Welsh will cotton on eventually. The reasons why are so long it would take a book bigger than war and peace to write out.

Well to be fair to steve , at least he is marginally honest in the fact he wants to give scotland a using to bolster englands left wing vote. Apart from that he hasnt much use for the jocks.

Labours problem is they are under fire as you say from all sides.

Too many folk have wisened up to them .

[Barry]

Well I guess they just cannot get the message Thomas. the Labour party are not wanted anywhere by anyone, The Scots have proved they are in a way better position without them the English are in the middle of making changes without them and the Welsh will cotton on eventually. The reasons why are so long it would take a book bigger than war and peace to write out.

Labour party dishonesty apparent = SNP party political broadcast. But we knew that was coming.

[Sheepy]

Well I guess they just cannot get the message Thomas. the Labour party are not wanted anywhere by anyone, The Scots have proved they are in a way better position without them the English are in the middle of making changes without them and the Welsh will cotton on eventually. The reasons why are so long it would take a book bigger than war and peace to write out.

[Thomas]

More labour party dishonesty here.

In 2018 jeremy corbyns labour party were calling on the snp scottish government to enshrine in law free bus passes for everyone over the age of 60 in scotland.



While in wales , the labour run welsh government were doing the exact oppostie to what labour were trying to make political capital out in scotland......



Its like shooting fish in a barrell sometimes with these labour types.

[Thomas]

You believe Tory manifesto promises?

How touching.

Prove that it is lies?

Says the man who believes the labour parties horseshit every election regarding helping the poor and fighting every conceivable injustice known to man....till theyget into power and laugh at you.

80 years labour were in charge of my city glasgow , from the days of the old coporation to the modern council , and they took glasgow from the second city of the empire to the worst , most poorest city with the lowest life expectancy in the entire western world. All off the back of blaming thatcher for every ill , promising to help the poor while lining their own pockets in the process.

As for labour party lies....







Instead of the promises the labour party made , we got an imposed settlement the voting scottish public were distinctly unimpressed with.

on top of that , we have labours twists and turns and lies over referndums. We had your hero wurzels position on scottish indy , with one political journalist saying corbyn had had more positions on scottish indy than hot dinners , then we had this shite to listen to from labour regarding second referendums.



Not just dugdale , but every labour leader and branch manager right through to corbyn and starmer saying the same ....

and yet when it comes to the european union , labour support the right of second referndums when the voters get it wrong.....







and you sarcastically tell me its touching i believe what the tories say?

If there are more gullible people on this earth than labour party voters , then i have yet to meet them.

[GerryT]

No one trusts Boris, but right now he is screwing the EU, which is fine by most Brexiters. As far as I can see, the object is to have open borders between the UK, Ulster and the Republic of Ireland, which should create a bloody great hole in the EU tariff wall, which will in turn mean the end of the Empire of Brussels. I could be wrong and BoJo will probably come up with another cunning plan by the end of the week, but right now it is the EU on the ropes and you can't say fairer than that.

Well if shooting yourself in the foot is a way to hurt your partner in a 3-leg race then yes, the UK is hurting the EU. Th way you see it is wrong. The GFA and now the WA, both of which the UK signed up to and both are international agreements. Finally both confirm there will be no border on the island of IRL. It mentions nothing about not having a border between NI and GB. No big hole in the EU "border"
Now the UK are threatening to break international law, which in itself is causing a major hit to the reputation of the UK as a trusted partner, leaving that aside to actually break it will be a breach of the Vienna convention Art27 which states a party may not invoke the provisions of its internal law as justification for its failure to perform a treaty. Even in the WA under Article 4, provides that the UK must use primary legislation to give full effect to the Withdrawal Agreement in domestic law.

Regarding cunning plans, Johnson would be more Baldrick than Blackadder.

[Good old]

Your quote from the manifesto. 

You claimed the tories want to get rid of human rights , and the tory manifesto clearly says it wants to keep and update them.

You are lying.

The idea of updating any law could easily include rendering its intended effect useless. Boris, attempts that right now on other issues.  Why would anyone trust him to not take advantage of such loose language as "update ", to reduce the rights these laws convey on us.

No one trusts Boris, but right now he is screwing the EU, which is fine by most Brexiters. As far as I can see, the object is to have open borders between the UK, Ulster and the Republic of Ireland, which should create a bloody great hole in the EU tariff wall, which will in turn mean the end of the Empire of Brussels. I could be wrong and BoJo will probably come up with another cunning plan by the end of the week, but right now it is the EU on the ropes and you can't say fairer than that.

I agree it's a breach in their armour he looks for. And that's why a deal of any real use will never happen. Unless they except Such a situation will have every single member handing in their cards.

[Borchester]

Your quote from the manifesto. 

You claimed the tories want to get rid of human rights , and the tory manifesto clearly says it wants to keep and update them.

You are lying.

The idea of updating any law could easily include rendering its intended effect useless. Boris, attempts that right now on other issues.  Why would anyone trust him to not take advantage of such loose language as "update ", to reduce the rights these laws convey on us.

No one trusts Boris, but right now he is screwing the EU, which is fine by most Brexiters. As far as I can see, the object is to have open borders between the UK, Ulster and the Republic of Ireland, which should create a bloody great hole in the EU tariff wall, which will in turn mean the end of the Empire of Brussels. I could be wrong and BoJo will probably come up with another cunning plan by the end of the week, but right now it is the EU on the ropes and you can't say fairer than that.

[srb7677]

Your quote from the manifesto. 

You claimed the tories want to get rid of human rights , and the tory manifesto clearly says it wants to keep and update them.

You are lying.

You believe Tory manifesto promises?

How touching.

[Good old]

Your quote from the manifesto. 

You claimed the tories want to get rid of human rights , and the tory manifesto clearly says it wants to keep and update them.

You are lying.

The idea of updating any law could easily include rendering its intended effect useless. Boris, attempts that right now on other issues.  Why would anyone trust him to not take advantage of such loose language as "update ", to reduce the rights these laws convey on us.

[Thomas]

[Thomas]

]I can actually understand where you are coming from. Were I living up there I'd probably feel the same way.

I cannot resist pointing out though that under previous management the Blairite wing was always too fond of Tory thinking. Cooperating with them came naturally. But I am not going to insult your intelligence by denying the existence of left wing unionists too.

You have ranted and raved at me a lot in recent weeks, but as an individual I am far more sympathetic to your position than many in my party. You should not be treating people like me as the enemy. Because if I had my way we'd leave unionism to the Tories, refuse to cooperate with them, and be neutral on independence except for those members actually in Scotland who can campaign however they want, preferably not alongside Tories.

Steve i think you take some things too seriously. You are not my enemy on a personal level , but politically we are not on the same side.

I appreciate what you are saying though regarding unionism , but the fact remains labour , whatever faction is in charge , is a pro union party based and headquartered in london who will not tolerate the union ending.

Corbyn may indeed have been lukewarm on the union , but his policy of supporting an indy referendum was a disgrace.

I have often pointed out labours achilles heel over indpendence where they believe it to be an intrinsic right to every country in the world excpet us. I cant and will not accpet that.



once the union was saved...





whatever your personal view , the labour party attitude to scottish independence is neither socialist nor internationalist.

...and scotland will not forget. You have burned all your bridges ( as a party) with both the scottish and english voter from what i can see im afraid.

[srb7677]

So Scotland's failure to vote for independence in 2014 is all Labour's fault? Sorry I don't buy that.

Labour provided the boots on the ground knocking on doors  , many of them not even scottish. Pro union leaflets and papers were printed off in your country and distributed  ,often with tory money , on the doorstep.

We could go on and on steve , but you did the tories dirty work for them in scotland in 2014 and the scottish people punished you accordingly when you betrayed them in the aftermath.

Its all water under the bridge now , we wont forget though.

Labour , .......better scotland lives under tory rule in the uk than is independent and free.

I can actually understand where you are coming from. Were I living up there I'd probably feel the same way.

I cannot resist pointing out though that under previous management the Blairite wing was always too fond of Tory thinking. Cooperating with them came naturally. But I am not going to insult your intelligence by denying the existence of left wing unionists too.

You have ranted and raved at me a lot in recent weeks, but as an individual I am far more sympathetic to your position than many in my party. You should not be treating people like me as the enemy. Because if I had my way we'd leave unionism to the Tories, refuse to cooperate with them, and be neutral on independence except for those members actually in Scotland who can campaign however they want, preferably not alongside Tories.

[Thomas]

So Scotland's failure to vote for independence in 2014 is all Labour's fault? Sorry I don't buy that.

Labour provided the boots on the ground knocking on doors  , many of them not even scottish. Pro union leaflets and papers were printed off in your country and distributed  ,often with tory money , on the doorstep.

We could go on and on steve , but you did the tories dirty work for them in scotland in 2014 and the scottish people punished you accordingly when you betrayed them in the aftermath.

Its all water under the bridge now , we wont forget though.

Labour , .......better scotland lives under tory rule in the uk than is independent and free.

[srb7677]

If it wasnt for the labour party scotland would be an independent country today and part of the european union

So Scotland's failure to vote for independence in 2014 is all Labour's fault? Sorry I don't buy that.