A Forum cabinet - just for fun

[Thomas]

Our 2017 policies were mostly not pie in the sky and were pretty modest - rent caps, security of tenure, a minimum wage in line with what people need to live on, an end to exploitative and insecure work contracts, etc. And polling revealed them to be popular. You don't make yourself more electable by abandoning the only things people liked about you

You dont know starmers policy on anyhting as he wont open his mouth for fear of offending you on the left of the party at present.

I doubt very much he is simply going to rehash your 2017 manifesto . He wants to take labour away from the corbyn days from what little he has insinuated.

He is boxed in big time , so is sitting with his fingers crossed praying ofr a miracle.

[Thomas]

In 2017 GE Corbyn was lauded as some sort of saint led by social media hysteria. By 2019 Corbyn and his policies were no longer novel. They were old hat and stale and obviously pie in the sky. His rhetoric was constantly and boringly repetitive and the novelty factor of 2017 had faded and died. Each time he opened his mouth he promised the world. Labour talked as if they had the crock of gold. He would never have won an election from then on and knew it. As did his puppeteers.

Starmer is a new game, but what he doesn't have that Corbyn had in spades is the oratory technique that he had obviously honed over decades of crowd manipulation. The only way Starmer can win an election in my view is to move the party much closer to the centre, but his enemies in the party will fight him every step of the way. They have tasted power in their own minds and won't relinquish it easily. The fact that they are totally out of step with the modern world seems to escape their consciousness.

I agree with some of that toots , but i dont agree starmer is a new game.

He is merely rehasing the old blairite party that milliband tried and dismally failed to get elected.

On top of that , no english brexiter will touch him with a bargepole at the enxt election. He has too much ant brexiter baggage.

Finally , if starmer moves labour back to the centre as the blairites always try and do , you heard the likes os SRB , they will fight him all the way internally.

On top of that , the old triangualtion doesnt work anymore the way it did for blair......back in blairs day , the left had no where to go , and eventually blair lost 4 miilion labour votes over the years.

Starmer doesnt have that luxury , and the former labour vote in england  can and will punish him badly , as we have done in scotland.

Blairism , like corbynism , rehashing the seventies or nineties labour party isnt the way forward. The political world is a massivley different place.

[srb7677]

If a new party came on the scene and started taking millions of labour and tory votes , like ukip did at one stage , srb would be shitting himself.

Actually that very much depends upon the nature of any new party. If it championed the struggling millions with the kind of policies Labour had in 2017, I'd be part of it.

In 2017 GE Corbyn was lauded as some sort of saint led by social media hysteria. By 2019 Corbyn and his policies were no longer novel. They were old hat and stale and obviously pie in the sky. His rhetoric was constantly and boringly repetitive and the novelty factor of 2017 had faded and died. Each time he opened his mouth he promised the world. Labour talked as if they had the crock of gold. He would never have won an election from then on and knew it. As did his puppeteers.

Starmer is a new game, but what he doesn't have that Corbyn had in spades is the oratory technique that he had obviously honed over decades of crowd manipulation. The only way Starmer can win an election in my view is to move the party much closer to the centre, but his enemies in the party will fight him every step of the way. They have tasted power in their own minds and won't relinquish it easily. The fact that they are totally out of step with the modern world seems to escape their consciousness.

Our 2017 policies were mostly not pie in the sky and were pretty modest - rent caps, security of tenure, a minimum wage in line with what people need to live on, an end to exploitative and insecure work contracts, etc. And polling revealed them to be popular. You don't make yourself more electable by abandoning the only things people liked about you

[T00ts]

If a new party came on the scene and started taking millions of labour and tory votes , like ukip did at one stage , srb would be shitting himself.

Actually that very much depends upon the nature of any new party. If it championed the struggling millions with the kind of policies Labour had in 2017, I'd be part of it.

In 2017 GE Corbyn was lauded as some sort of saint led by social media hysteria. By 2019 Corbyn and his policies were no longer novel. They were old hat and stale and obviously pie in the sky. His rhetoric was constantly and boringly repetitive and the novelty factor of 2017 had faded and died. Each time he opened his mouth he promised the world. Labour talked as if they had the crock of gold. He would never have won an election from then on and knew it. As did his puppeteers.

Starmer is a new game, but what he doesn't have that Corbyn had in spades is the oratory technique that he had obviously honed over decades of crowd manipulation. The only way Starmer can win an election in my view is to move the party much closer to the centre, but his enemies in the party will fight him every step of the way. They have tasted power in their own minds and won't relinquish it easily. The fact that they are totally out of step with the modern world seems to escape their consciousness.

[Thomas]

Well, Lab managed to pick a leader who is 'the enemy of women' and another who covered up child abuse in Islington and who's paper pub'd a piece defending the rights of noncey ^^nts to be just that.

What more need be said, Labour should dissolve in a pool of battery acid. I mean they were utter liars as far back as Ramsey MacDonald.

im not sure though is an snp party came on the scene in england it would be sufficiently left wing enough for steve , and im not meaning that as an insult.

Im simply saying the snp appeal is its centrist rather than left wing policy , and of course first and foremost scot indy.

If a new anti eu ENP came on the scene , appealing to small c tories  , business , centre left etc , would that be a party many on the brit left currently could support?

Im not sure , judging by what i read on these forums.

[Borg Refinery]

Well, Lab managed to pick a leader who is 'the enemy of women' and another who covered up child abuse in Islington and who's paper pub'd a piece defending the rights of noncey ^^nts to be just that.

What more need be said, Labour should dissolve in a pool of battery acid. I mean they were utter liars as far back as Ramsey MacDonald.

[Thomas]

If a new party came on the scene and started taking millions of labour and tory votes , like ukip did at one stage , srb would be shitting himself.

Actually that very much depends upon the nature of any new party. If it championed the struggling millions with the kind of policies Labour had in 2017, I'd be part of it.

Sure , and thats what the snp did for years , while your labour party , both blairite and corbynite , called us tartan tories for taking your vote.

Its not beyond the means of the english people to vote into power a new party to destroy the old two party system as the snp have done in scotland.

Would you be comfrotable though with a party that wasnt left wing enough?

As i said , the snp is centrist in scotland , and has a mix of policy , some of which is extremely pro business.

[srb7677]

If a new party came on the scene and started taking millions of labour and tory votes , like ukip did at one stage , srb would be shitting himself.

Actually that very much depends upon the nature of any new party. If it championed the struggling millions with the kind of policies Labour had in 2017, I'd be part of it.

[Thomas]

Keir Starmer to urge Labour voters in Scotland to 'take another look' under his leadership - daily (broken) record

Ha ha.

As far as lying duplicitous bastards go in appealing to the livestock, he's a lawyer so a top talent in that area. I have seen so many people say "I will never vote for x" then do so under some vagaries or another, they really are medical grade shitebags.. the types moving mindlessly from LD to Lab to Tories to BXP to Greens, seemlessly as it is indeed the westminster party.

I kind of wonder, if the BXP do clean up in England under, to paraphrase Bork, a "amoral dishonest bastard" banner - might it at least it spur on the creation of new parties? And could they be any worse than these Tories, not sure?

So let the Tories implode, let the boneheaded stone age thinkers and drinkers across parties lose their heads, and maybe somehow it will shake things up..

i keep saying dyno , no matter what the policy  , he isnt going to attract any indy voter in scotland , and is merely battling it out with the tories and liberals for the unionist vote.

Remember , it was murphy , the arch blairite like starmer , who lost 40/41 labour sets in 2015. It wasnt just corbyn.

[Borg Refinery]

Keir Starmer to urge Labour voters in Scotland to 'take another look' under his leadership - daily (broken) record

Ha ha.

As far as lying duplicitous bastards go in appealing to the livestock, he's a lawyer so a top talent in that area. I have seen so many people say "I will never vote for x" then do so under some vagaries or another, they really are medical grade shitebags.. the types moving mindlessly from LD to Lab to Tories to BXP to Greens, seemlessly as it is indeed the westminster party.

I kind of wonder, if the BXP do clean up in England under, to paraphrase Bork, a "amoral dishonest bastard" banner - might it at least it spur on the creation of new parties? And could they be any worse than these Tories, not sure?

So let the Tories implode, let the boneheaded stone age thinkers and drinkers across parties lose their heads, and maybe somehow it will shake things up..

[Thomas]

Not yet they aren't, it is building up though. The funny part is new labour are still thinking it will be for their advantage and they can keep the whole farce alive, I wouldn't bet on it, if I was them.

Thats what im saying sheep.......srb and labour are stuck in a rut replaying age old tropes whilst hoping the political system wont change and they will end up in power wihtout having to do anything meaningfull or new.

If i were them , i would be worried about the fact that apparent dissent with the tory government isnt transalting into an astounding lead after ten years.

I remember the days when they used to shout and jeer about the snp and laugh . The cants arent laughing now.

They all denied the electorate a referendum on the EU for decades, then they couldn't get into power without one, no I bet they ain't all laughing now.

They promised some sort of european ref in 2005 , and then reneged on it when voted into power.

You cant trust them over anything.

Liars to the core of that party.

[Sheepy]

Not yet they aren't, it is building up though. The funny part is new labour are still thinking it will be for their advantage and they can keep the whole farce alive, I wouldn't bet on it, if I was them.

Thats what im saying sheep.......srb and labour are stuck in a rut replaying age old tropes whilst hoping the political system wont change and they will end up in power wihtout having to do anything meaningfull or new.

If i were them , i would be worried about the fact that apparent dissent with the tory government isnt transalting into an astounding lead after ten years.

I remember the days when they used to shout and jeer about the snp and laugh . The cants arent laughing now.

They all denied the electorate a referendum on the EU for decades, then they couldn't get into power without one, no I bet they ain't all laughing now.

[Thomas]

Not yet they aren't, it is building up though. The funny part is new labour are still thinking it will be for their advantage and they can keep the whole farce alive, I wouldn't bet on it, if I was them.

Thats what im saying sheep.......srb and labour are stuck in a rut replaying age old tropes whilst hoping the political system wont change and they will end up in power wihtout having to do anything meaningfull or new.

If i were them , i would be worried about the fact that apparent dissent with the tory government isnt transalting into an astounding lead after ten years.

I remember the days when they used to shout and jeer about the snp and laugh . The cants arent laughing now.

[Sheepy]

I confidently predict, you will predict the same thing you have been predicting for over a decade, I also predict for all of the bombarding of the electorate in hard times and with the Chinese sniffles rife and the rise of mental health problems, the electorate will decide new labour are the same duplicitous bastards they have always been.

If a new party came on the scene and started taking millions of labour and tory votes , like ukip did at one stage , srb would be shitting himself.

He is relying things always staying the same in the lab/tory tennis match at westminster so labour dont have to think or do anything , but just let the dodgy FPTP two party system put them into power .

They are eventually going to get their hands burned big time just as they have in scotland. You can see the english people are feckin bone weary of both labour and conservative.

Not yet they aren't, it is building up though. The funny part is new labour are still thinking it will be for their advantage and they can keep the whole farce alive, I wouldn't bet on it, if I was them.

[Thomas]

I confidently predict, you will predict the same thing you have been predicting for over a decade, I also predict for all of the bombarding of the electorate in hard times and with the Chinese sniffles rife and the rise of mental health problems, the electorate will decide new labour are the same duplicitous bastards they have always been.

If a new party came on the scene and started taking millions of labour and tory votes , like ukip did at one stage , srb would be shitting himself.

He is relying things always staying the same in the lab/tory tennis match at westminster so labour dont have to think or do anything , but just let the dodgy FPTP two party system put them into power .

They are eventually going to get their hands burned big time just as they have in scotland. You can see the english people are feckin bone weary of both labour and conservative.