Macron v UK + EU

[GerryT]

You%u2019re forgetting one thing Gerry.

The EU is going to deal. They will crumble at the 11th hour as they always do.

Obviously the EU has some history dealing with 3rd countries and doing this, maybe you could enlighten us.

Unlike the UK, when in January Johnson took Mays WA, made it worse for the UK and signed at the 11th Hr.

What your getting confused with is the EU does accomadate its members, because that's what the EU is, a club with members. No ruling party or controlling member state. Its why the UK could keep sterling, stay out of schengen, didn't adopt the charter on human rights for fears of more labour strikes (we wouldn't want workers having more rights in the uk) and the UK opted out of the Lisbon treaty provisions on all criminal justice.

I think you will see a very different EU as a non member, the bending and accomadating is for members not non members. And you'r not being punished, a lot of other countries you can deal with.

[Sheepy]

This absolute nonsense came up earlier about Irexit, let's just put that to bed. There is zero appetite to leave the EU, we think its a brilliant club and looking at whats happening in the UK would only go to solidify that position.
Yes we have some nutters, gemma Doherty is a good example,but every country has these, we just let them shout and their on ignore. Even when farage came over he could only muster a couple of hundred, most that went were curious. At that time in 2018 IRL polled in the 90% for EU membership and earlier this yr its in the 80%. The Irish are mad but we're not that mad.

If there is a border its because of the UK leaving the EU with zero consideration for its only land border.
Thankfully Johnson agreed to a border in the UK and not in Ireland. That was nice of Johnson wasn't it.

But in reality, you know it's true. Spin is beside the point. Let's face it, the last thing the EU want is the Irish finding out they have been had over by the EU and are minor pawns in their game.

[GerryT]

Gerry spouts complete cobblers, because he is worried the Irish might rise up again against their masters the EU, so if they can beat down the UK and blame it on the English, even better. The EU wins the Irish can be bitter about the English and not the EU.
Even when the EU said they would put up a border, he blamed it on the UK.

This absolute nonsense came up earlier about Irexit, let's just put that to bed. There is zero appetite to leave the EU, we think its a brilliant club and looking at whats happening in the UK would only go to solidify that position.
Yes we have some nutters, gemma Doherty is a good example,but every country has these, we just let them shout and their on ignore. Even when farage came over he could only muster a couple of hundred, most that went were curious. At that time in 2018 IRL polled in the 90% for EU membership and earlier this yr its in the 80%. The Irish are mad but we're not that mad.

If there is a border its because of the UK leaving the EU with zero consideration for its only land border.
Thankfully Johnson agreed to a border in the UK and not in Ireland. That was nice of Johnson wasn't it.

[BeElBeeBub]

aye and we have discussed it many a time over the last four years.

So it should be trivial to come up with an example of an MP behaving undemocratically.

[Sheepy]

I doubt it.

Probably a good thing, because they have said all along there is no way of leaving with a deal that doesn't give them control.

[papasmurf]

You're forgetting one thing Gerry.

The EU is going to deal. They will crumble at the 11th hour as they always do.

I doubt it.

[Nick]

Of course you will, just that your Govt are going to slap some heavy tariffs on, so you can pay a lot more "tax".
Then there's the issue of getting them, maybe fly them in because the UK has nothing ready for Jan. No kent lorry park, no working customs declaration IT system, no 50 000 customs officials.
Let's see how the trade talks go, because as we all know the EU needs the UK so much more than the UK does, lucky that !

You're forgetting one thing Gerry.

The EU is going to deal. They will crumble at the 11th hour as they always do.

[GerryT]

Well as long as bojo doesnt sell out the uk and cave into demands of abiding by eu rules , accepting eu laws and all the rest , its going to be absolutely spiffing gerry.

I see many opportunites on the horizon , and after a crap year with the chinese sniffles , brexit is looking like the prize at the end of  a long road.

I applaud your positivity but seen as what you list isn't on the table from the EU I've no idea how Johnson could sign up to them. But he is a moron of unequal measure so maybe he could do just that.
On governance the EU are looking for a robust system to rule on disputes which would be an independent body.
On Fishing the EU is looking to negoatiate, thats the name of the game, if the UK don't like it they just say no or counter offer. Thats not a demand as you put it. The UK has the right to accept or walk away but so does the EU. theres no demands from either side.

[Sheepy]

Well as long as bojo doesnt sell out the uk and cave into demands of abiding by eu rules , accepting eu laws and all the rest , its going to be absolutely spiffing gerry.

I see many opportunites on the horizon , and after a crap year with the chinese sniffles , brexit is looking like the prize at the end of  a long road.

Gerry spouts complete cobblers, because he is worried the Irish might rise up again against their masters the EU, so if they can beat down the UK and blame it on the English, even better. The EU wins the Irish can be bitter about the English and not the EU.
Even when the EU said they would put up a border, he blamed it on the UK.

[GerryT]

This is just waffle to detract from a well made point, which you don't deny.

I think you'll find out very soon that the point is the Brexit gives you nothing you didn't all ready have and in return you will pay more for goods outside the UK AND selling UK goods abroad will be far harder. Thats the reality of brexit. No one ever said you won't be able to buy EU foods.

[Thomas]

#still searching for the mythical remain majority#

[Thomas]

can you point to an instance where remain Parliamentarians behaved undemocratically

aye and we have discussed it many a time over the last four years.

or broke the law?

Where did i say they broke the law?

Is this a regurgitation of the old remain bleat from post 2017 when we were told the remain parliament could over turn the brexit result and stop it from being implemented and you werent doing anythig wrong?

....lmfao.

...and then you had to face the consequences of your actions in december last year...........how did that turn out beely?

[Thomas]

Let's see how the trade talks go, because as we all know the EU needs the UK so much more than the UK does, lucky that !

Well as long as bojo doesnt sell out the uk and cave into demands of abiding by eu rules , accepting eu laws and all the rest , its going to be absolutely spiffing gerry.

I see many opportunites on the horizon , and after a crap year with the chinese sniffles , brexit is looking like the prize at the end of  a long road.

[BeElBeeBub]

Are you denying parliamentary remainers , and those who have led the remain side , have tried undemocratically non stop over the last four years not to just oppose and offer dissent to brexit , but to try and stop the democratic result being implemented cheered on by you and your like?

can you point to an instance where remain Parliamentarians behaved undemocratically or broke the law?

How can an MP voting in parliament be undemocratic?  This is one of the things Leave campaigned for?

Voting against a bill or to amend a bill or whatever is intrinsically democratic.

Demanding that all MPs vote for government policies or be branded undemocratic traitors is the stuff of dictatorship.

I should also point out the biggest instance of unlawful behaviours by Parliamentarians in recent times was by Johnson, Rees Mogg etc when they unlawful suspended parliament and misled the queen in order to prevent parliament from carrying out it's constitutional duty.

[Barry]

The UK is or will be fully sovereign jan 1, oh wait, no they won't be, they signed away so much to Japan, for what ?  About 15b in exports, yep a full 15b. Compared to near 295b to the EU. But the UK can sign up to worse terms with Japan but can't agree with the EU.
The EU is looking to agree 3rd party governance on oversight and of course you follow our standards  just like any country selling into the UK will need to follow UK standards.

Barry how many trade deals has the UK agreed where those deals are fully on the UK terms which is what you seem to want.

This is just waffle to detract from a well made point, which you don't deny.