How could direct democracy work?

[Borchester]

like all governments , the tories have screwed up on some things , and done better at others.

...but if labour have nothing to offer the electorate other than "we know we are shite , but at least we arent the tories" then i personally think they are going to be a long time out of power.

During that time , who knows if another party might come along in england like the snp and others have done in scotland to "eclipse" them as the alternative.

People wont vote for "tory bad......torys have screwed up" as i keep telling you.

Well, as most all of us have already said in the kindliest possible manner,
(Comment removed by Barry - please stop the personal insults!)

As to the Tories, they are into power. A seemingly obvious point but one that the left has never grasped. TheTories are the low tax party that is happy to spend mega bucks on the this flu business, cover London's green belt, pour sack loads of cash into the bottomless pit of self entitlement of the education system and all the rest. After he was elected leader, Boris gathered together all the other candidates and said that had all come up with some good ideas about how things should run and he intended to pinch them and claim them as his own. And the other candidates grinned ruefully because that is what Tories do.

Not the left. Great swathes of it are still dreaming of reopening the coal mines, making Agnes Fairchild party leader and whatever policies it can think up to piss off the electorate.

Mod edited

[Sheepy]

What's up snowflakes, Boris thinks we need a government worth our while taking on, fastest growing political movement on the planet.

[Thomas]

They already have, but people appear to be blind to it.

like all governments , the tories have screwed up on some things , and done better at others.

...but if labour have nothing to offer the electorate other than "we know we are shite , but at least we arent the tories" then i personally think they are going to be a long time out of power.

During that time , who knows if another party might come along in england like the snp and others have done in scotland to "eclipse" them as the alternative.

People wont vote for "tory bad......torys have screwed up" as i keep telling you.

[Thomas]

Well, for a start, you need to factor into the 2019 election the fact that a majority of labour candidates went into May's disastrous 2017 gamble with solid manifesto commitments to "respect the voice of the people" (the exact words used by half a dozen MPs round here including mine) and we found that as soon as they got back they did anything but.


Boris' success in 2019 was down to two years of labour attempts to hamstring Boris in a zombie parliament.

Aye john , i think its wishfull thinking the electorate voted for the tories because they are forward thinking positive and charismatic.

Pure and simple first and foremost it was down to brexit as you say , then you work down the list of other issues after that follow on behind like best of a bad bunch in a two horse race.

[johnofgwent]

Some of the electorate voted for such policies in 2017 — or more likely it was May (who has the charisma of a breeze block when dealing with people) who lost support.

But it's now 2021, and Labour has lost two general elections — the latest so heavily because the attraction of the Tory leader and his optimistic demeanor. Unless the Tories really screw up, Labour needs a leader with as much, or greater, appeal to stand a hope of gaining power...

Well, for a start, you need to factor into the 2019 election the fact that a majority of labour candidates went into May's disastrous 2017 gamble with solid manifesto commitments to "respect the voice of the people" (the exact words used by half a dozen MPs round here including mine) and we found that as soon as they got back they did anything but.


Boris' success in 2019 was down to two years of labour attempts to hamstring Boris in a zombie parliament.

[srb7677]

I don't like to say it but you seem to have come a long way from the days of hang the last capitalist with Priti Patel's garters

I wouldn't touch Priti Patel's garters with yours, .

[Nick]

Ask Nick what he is going to do about it, nothing, but hide behind the Tories pretending he knows what we are planning. Hoping we will just fade away.

In order to fade away you have to form in the first place. 😂 😂 😂

[Sheepy]

Ask Nick what he is going to do about it, nothing, but hide behind the Tories pretending he knows what we are planning. Hoping we will just fade away.

[Sheepy]

They already have, but people appear to be blind to it.

The majority of people in the real world and I don't mean in gods waiting room are not blind to it, or blind to the other parties either, at the moment there is no recourse for the electorate and they know it, which like it or not you have to take the pain while the other half the Westminster party think we will all fall for it again. Including thinking populists are carers not serious political opposition. Take it from me, we ain't  so best get used to it. Just because a few old fools think they know what they are doing while awaiting the last breath makes no odds.

[papasmurf]

Unless the Tories really screw up,

They already have, but people appear to be blind to it.

[patman post]

Yet clearly they like policies such as these as demonstrated by the polling, which you ignored as inconvenient facts.... https://www.businessinsider.com/poll-huge-public-support-for-jeremy-corbyns-manifesto-promises-2017-5?r=US&IR=T

Some of the electorate voted for such policies in 2017 — or more likely it was May (who has the charisma of a breeze block when dealing with people) who lost support.

But it's now 2021, and Labour has lost two general elections — the latest so heavily because the attraction of the Tory leader and his optimistic demeanor. Unless the Tories really screw up, Labour needs a leader with as much, or greater, appeal to stand a hope of gaining power...

[Borchester]

Yet clearly they like policies such as these as demonstrated by the polling, which you ignored as inconvenient facts....

https://www.businessinsider.com/poll-huge-public-support-for-jeremy-corbyns-manifesto-promises-2017-5?r=US&IR=T

What are you doing reading the business news Steve?

I don't like to say it but you seem to have come a long way from the days of hang the last capitalist with Priti Patel's garters

[srb7677]

I think you conveniently dismiss the ability of the electorate to know both what it wants and what it doesn't trust.   

The ready examples of the way the Labour party's extreme Left activists engineered Corbyn and Ed Miliband into the Labour leadership, and the way internal factions like Momentum have tried to take over the party, are not fabricated smears taken on-board by Right Wingers. They happened, and the electorate saw that they were bad, and wanted something better. 

They liked the messages of hope given out by parties that believe in rewards for effort in the last few elections, rather than compensation for being poor...

Yet clearly they like policies such as these as demonstrated by the polling, which you ignored as inconvenient facts....

https://www.businessinsider.com/poll-huge-public-support-for-jeremy-corbyns-manifesto-promises-2017-5?r=US&IR=T

[cromwell]

Thread re opened please stick to the topic not insults or Tory bad.
Thanks

[Barry]

Moderator notice
I'm closing this topic for a cool down period. Some posts have been unapproved pending moderation.
Sheepy, it's not really like you to abuse other members. Please don't.
Papasmurf, stop trying to turn every thread into a Tory bad thread.