Aukus

[papasmurf]

We both know that.
The question was

Would their money laundering and corruption be anything like on the scale of the UK ?

Do you know ?

Actually Britain is low on the corruption scale:-

https://www.transparency.org/en/cpi/2020/index/gbr

[GerryT]

Oh hello Gerry how's the ladybird book of European history,got far yet.

Have you got to when the French resistance was formed?

We both know that.
The question was

Would their money laundering and corruption be anything like on the scale of the UK ?

Do you know ?

[GerryT]

I spent a couple of years making stuff for it ...


The submarine design the French were offering the Australians was identified in one of the many newspaper articles I read to get myself up to speed on this strange business of localisation of materials. I forget which but it is out there. In essence the French were offering the Australians a copy of a vessel they currently have in service themselves.


I found this article today


https://www.rfi.fr/en/france/20161220-australia-and-france-sign-deal-build-12-submarines


It describes the subs as a cut down version of France's state of the art Barracuda class with the same stealth capability

I read from other articles that the French and others seek to call this a violation of nuclear proliferation treaties. I read that New Zealand for example refuses point blank to have nuclear powered vessels in its territorial waters, not just nuclear weapons


I do not know if fear of breaching non nuclear proliferation was a factor in not offering nuclear options.


I do know from past experience that several French arms dealers are the ultimate amoral true neutral. Dassault for example were more than happy to supply Iraq with fighter planes long after Saddam had become "not a nice guy" but then my employers yank partner did a very dodgy deal to sell cluster bombs and other munitions through a shell company called "allivane international" (look it up).


Allivane basically took air launch weapons fused and fitted to be attached to Dassault Super Entendards and wrote up fraudulent paperwork saying these were being shipped to Saudi for attachment to Tornado Ground Recon fighters.


When the truth came out, the real customer refused to pay and my employer went bust. I went freelancing and toy amazement worked alongside the brother of the lycing CEI's lawyer. It's a very, very small world.




Seriously, I have no idea if the French had the authority or the political will to offer nuclear powered subs.


I know the French have both nuclear powered conventionally armed, and ballistic nuclear capable subs


https://www.nti.org/analysis/articles/france-submarine-capabilities/

I would say France would have the authority to make a nuclear sub if they wanted to as it's their design. I presume they are far more expensive, but in the end the AUS purchased diesel. If they wanted nuclear they could have bought one from another country back in 2015, so AUS have changed their mind. No issue there but it doesn't sound like all avenues were exhausted in trying to resolve issues with France, or we wouldn't have the scenes we are seeing. Either way it's a political nightmare for AUS and the US are getting themselves in the fireing line which is very naive of them.

[GerryT]

More potentially bad news for the EU....

Concerns Rise as Bulgaria Prepares to Join the Euro
Bulgaria has significant problems with corruption and money laundering. Nevertheless, the European Union is prepared to accept the country as the next member of the eurozone. Many fear that might be a bad idea.

https://www.spiegel.de/international/europe/controversial-eurozone-accession-concerns-rise-as-bulgaria-prepares-to-join-the-euro-a-034fbab7-e91a-4e0f-92d4-a8d44640dc37

How is that bad news ?
Bulgaria is a member of the EU, no change their.
Their currency is pegged to the EURO, with a fixed exchange rate since last yr.
If they join the EURO it will be 2024, which will be four yrs of having their currency locked in against the EURO, if they managed to get through Covid with a pegged currency they have stress tested the proposition and should be fine, but there's another 2.5 yrs to see.

What's your issue with Bulgaria, do you think you are better or superior to them, it's coming across that way.

[Borchester]

You really should not support Smurfs doom and gloom outlook, especially in the face of so much evidence to disprove it.

I was there a few weeks ago and purchase fresh Cornish shellfish from Tesco.
I took my boat out from Falmouth and bought Crab of the local fisherman, directly off his boat.
There is a list of outlets still trading on the internet.

So that's that put to bed once and for all.

If Pappy says so it must be so and I am frankly amazed that Nick falls for all these Tory lies.

[cromwell]

Would their money laundering and corruption be anything like on the scale of the UK ?

Oh hello Gerry how's the ladybird book of European history,got far yet.

Have you got to when the French resistance was formed?

[johnofgwent]

You seen to know a lot about this industry. I don't in fairness, so do you know what french design these subs were based on, could France have offered a Nuclear sub option. Is it normal in this industry that after several years into a contract that the customer would change to a second supplier. In your reading was France behind schedule and was it a term of the contract that such an occurance could lead to contract cancellation. If you know that would be great. If you don't your talking nonsense above.

I spent a couple of years making stuff for it ...


The submarine design the French were offering the Australians was identified in one of the many newspaper articles I read to get myself up to speed on this strange business of localisation of materials. I forget which but it is out there. In essence the French were offering the Australians a copy of a vessel they currently have in service themselves.


I found this article today


https://www.rfi.fr/en/france/20161220-australia-and-france-sign-deal-build-12-submarines


It describes the subs as a cut down version of France's state of the art Barracuda class with the same stealth capability

I read from other articles that the French and others seek to call this a violation of nuclear proliferation treaties. I read that New Zealand for example refuses point blank to have nuclear powered vessels in its territorial waters, not just nuclear weapons


I do not know if fear of breaching non nuclear proliferation was a factor in not offering nuclear options.


I do know from past experience that several French arms dealers are the ultimate amoral true neutral. Dassault for example were more than happy to supply Iraq with fighter planes long after Saddam had become "not a nice guy" but then my employers yank partner did a very dodgy deal to sell cluster bombs and other munitions through a shell company called "allivane international" (look it up).


Allivane basically took air launch weapons fused and fitted to be attached to Dassault Super Entendards and wrote up fraudulent paperwork saying these were being shipped to Saudi for attachment to Tornado Ground Recon fighters.


When the truth came out, the real customer refused to pay and my employer went bust. I went freelancing and toy amazement worked alongside the brother of the lycing CEI's lawyer. It's a very, very small world.




Seriously, I have no idea if the French had the authority or the political will to offer nuclear powered subs.


I know the French have both nuclear powered conventionally armed, and ballistic nuclear capable subs


https://www.nti.org/analysis/articles/france-submarine-capabilities/

[GerryT]

More potentially bad news for the EU....

Concerns Rise as Bulgaria Prepares to Join the Euro
Bulgaria has significant problems with corruption and money laundering. Nevertheless, the European Union is prepared to accept the country as the next member of the eurozone. Many fear that might be a bad idea.

https://www.spiegel.de/international/europe/controversial-eurozone-accession-concerns-rise-as-bulgaria-prepares-to-join-the-euro-a-034fbab7-e91a-4e0f-92d4-a8d44640dc37

Would their money laundering and corruption be anything like on the scale of the UK ?

[Thomas]

The second biggest net contributor in the U.K. sods off leaving a 10 billion hole, what do they do? Invite another snivelling wretch to the trough. Couldn't make it 😂

Bulgaria!!!

Feckin ?Bulgaria!!!

I tell you nick you can see why gerry is getting increasingly agitated on this site about his beloved EU and their relentless march into disaster.

[Nick]

More potentially bad news for the EU....

Concerns Rise as Bulgaria Prepares to Join the Euro
Bulgaria has significant problems with corruption and money laundering. Nevertheless, the European Union is prepared to accept the country as the next member of the eurozone. Many fear that might be a bad idea.

https://www.spiegel.de/international/europe/controversial-eurozone-accession-concerns-rise-as-bulgaria-prepares-to-join-the-euro-a-034fbab7-e91a-4e0f-92d4-a8d44640dc37

The second biggest net contributor in the U.K. sods off leaving a 10 billion hole, what do they do? Invite another snivelling wretch to the trough. Couldn't make it 😂

[Thomas]

More potentially bad news for the EU....

Concerns Rise as Bulgaria Prepares to Join the Euro
Bulgaria has significant problems with corruption and money laundering. Nevertheless, the European Union is prepared to accept the country as the next member of the eurozone. Many fear that might be a bad idea.

https://www.spiegel.de/international/europe/controversial-eurozone-accession-concerns-rise-as-bulgaria-prepares-to-join-the-euro-a-034fbab7-e91a-4e0f-92d4-a8d44640dc37

[Thomas]

Looks like even more toys have come out the pram, French cancelling meetings all over the place. It looks like the ability to conduct business on our own without asking for permission is the future.

The French are clearly unhappy nick , but macron is really stirring the pot to deflect away from his growing problems at home.

AUKUS is just part of a long list of recent "bad press" for the EU including the vaccine scandal which has people thinking about the blocs future and viability.

There is only three credible armed forces on the european continent , the russians , british and French , and the EU know how vulnerable they are without the uk.

Dutch PM Rutte to invite Britain to join defence deal with EU -The Times

Sept 16 (Reuters) - British Prime Minister Boris Johnson is set to be offered a defence and security co-operation deal with the European Union during a meeting with Dutch Prime Minister Mark Rutte in Downing Street on Friday, the Times newspaper reported, citing a diplomatic source.

"Since Brexit, not enough European leaders have been in touch with Johnson. It is important to look at the geopolitics without being divided and there is a need to work with the UK," the source said.

https://www.reuters.com/world/dutch-pm-rutte-invite-britain-join-defence-deal-with-eu-the-times-2021-09-16/

This is the same dutch pm who said the uk was too small on its own and would collapse without the EU 

[Nick]

Looks like even more toys have come out the pram, French cancelling meetings all over the place. It looks like the ability to conduct business on our own without asking for permission is the future.

[papasmurf]

You may as well be talking to the wall. They cromwell jumps on the band wagon with game set and match, painful to watch

Quite. No wonder the Tories are incompetent if they don't understand when an industry loses 95% of it market overnight, (which is what happened on January the 1st 2021.) Businesses have to close down quick, which is what happened. Also not knowing the difference between a producer and a seller who uses multiple suppliers shows a frankly unbelievable ignorance.
I cannot understand how anyone can be that stupid, (other than the current government and George Useless.)

[Barry]

Cromwell i suspect he hasnt been further inland than some breton coastal holiday resort and static caravan. The guy talks utter cac and i admire nick  taking the time to argue with him , but you can't debate stupid.

I thought that was a poster called Lankou or something.
Completely different to Papasmurf.