Spread of Covid, will vaccines stop it, will you get vaccines forever?

[Sheepy]

Vaccine Researcher Admits 'Big Mistake,' Says Spike Protein Is Dangerous 'Toxin'  | The Tatty Journal
I thought we might get Tatty then.
no worries, mate, nobody else is admitting it, oh but wait.

[Scott777]

Died WITH COVID, not necessarily from covid. 28 day ruling so could have been hit by a bus. 

Well, yes, that's true, and a reminder that none of the data is reliable.

[Sheepy]

Died WITH COVID, not necessarily from covid. 28 day ruling so could have been hit by a bus. You're really pulling these links out of the bag Sheep, are we struggling to find anything to back your theory on something resembling a reputable website? 😂 

Not really, just wondering if you are following the science yet, as you jabbed types seem to think you are now an unquestionable authority on science. 

[Nick]

Thousands of double jabbed over 50s died from Covid [Video] (aol.co.uk)
We have been following the science guv, sure you have.

Died WITH COVID, not necessarily from covid. 28 day ruling so could have been hit by a bus. You're really pulling these links out of the bag Sheep, are we struggling to find anything to back your theory on something resembling a reputable website? 😂  

[Barry]

It's a blood test for immunity. If the government have the will they would make it happen, but they are using a one size fits all approach.
Healthy people who are immune do not need a jab which might harm them. So we'll give everyone a booster anyway.

Doesn't matter what manufacturer it is either

[T00ts]

I said 6 million healthy people.

Sorry Sir! I mixed up the 6 and 60 but even so how do we test for immunity?  Ok I found it. Blood test. Lots of private tests available. I guess if someone had personal  verification of natural immunity that should be allowed alongside those with proof of jabs. It would be interesting to get one myself.

[Scott777]

It is only impossible because the government won't fund it. We are currently testing 6 million healthy people every day at a cost of £60 million per day so why can't antibody tests be done for both natural and jab immunity?

At the end of the day, Barry, I don't agree with testing of people who have no symptoms of disease.  Symptoms should be the test of illness, as they normally are.  And it will not check for T-cells and B-cells, which probably last decades.

[Scott777]

That's the first time you have made sense to me and there is a recognition that different needs require different responses.  Anyone with any sense realises that with every medical intervention there is an element of risk, that cannot be denied hence the regime of reporting and recording any adverse effects both of which my one daughter and an elderly friend with a serious heart condition have been involved with. The jury is still out with Ivermectin. I have heard strong arguments that transmission is reduced by having the jab if for no other reason than the degree of illness is reduced. What frightens people in my view is the argument that we should do nothing but rely on natural immunity. This is just not reliable.
In fairness anyone who has had Covid should have the option of testing to see the strength of their immunity but once again the numbers understandably make this impossible. Thank you for a measured post which has cheered me up no end.

Glad to see some mutual understanding.  The biggest issue is when some people (including government) are pushing jabs for all.  But the 'different needs' point is absolutely true.  That also should apply to who gets the jab, just as it always has for any medical treatment.  Since when did healthy people need treatment, anyway?  😉

[Barry]

Sorry you've lost me. Which 60m healthy people? If immunity testing involves a blood test that is quite a demand. I had a blood test over a week ago and am still awaiting the results. I'm assuming they are under pressure.

I said 6 million healthy people.

[Scott777]

https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/bulletins/deathsinvolvingcovid19byvaccinationstatusengland/deathsoccurringbetween2januaryand24september2021

Probably bullshit is the answer,

Thanks for the info.

If I were to assume this is meaningful, here is another interpretation that I MIGHT make.

Looking at all deaths, out of single dose vaccinated - : more people died after 21 days, than before, (from 811 to 1,124).  And out of double jabbed, again more people died after 21 days (from 464 to 783).  Does that mean people are more likely to die after the vaccine starts to wear off, or something?  Who knows?

However, as Mr Gwent says, it's probably rubbish.  "While the ASMRs provide evidence that vaccinated individuals have a lower risk of dying of coronavirus (COVID-19) than unvaccinated individuals, they cannot be used to determine vaccine effectiveness."  Ooops.

[Borchester]

Sorry you've lost me. Which 60m healthy people? If immunity testing involves a blood test that is quite a demand. I had a blood test over a week ago and am still awaiting the results. I'm assuming they are under pressure.

The NHS is always under pressure.

And under paid.

But dedicated.

Etc etc.

The bottom line is that we have had a nasty attack of the flu and an even worse case of running around like blue arsed flies which is humiliating.

[T00ts]

It is only impossible because the government won't fund it. We are currently testing 6 million healthy people every day at a cost of £60 million per day so why can't antibody tests be done for both natural and jab immunity?

Sorry you've lost me. Which 60m healthy people? If immunity testing involves a blood test that is quite a demand. I had a blood test over a week ago and am still awaiting the results. I'm assuming they are under pressure.

[Barry]

In fairness anyone who has had Covid should have the option of testing to see the strength of their immunity but once again the numbers understandably make this impossible. 

It is only impossible because the government won't fund it. We are currently testing 6 million healthy people every day at a cost of £60 million per day so why can't antibody tests be done for both natural and jab immunity?

[T00ts]

I just have to point out, it's not a question of whether the jabs protect vulnerable people from Covid.  That's seems true, and not really in dispute.  But it's a false argument if the risks are ignored.  Just because it helps Covid does not mean it won't cause harm, and that is unknown.  It's also very likely most people have had Covid in the last 20 months.  That would mean they have a degree of natural immunity, either from antibodies or T-cell & B-cell immunity.  These people should not be at much risk, and in that case, the jab does nothing to protect them.  And Ivermectin works, so that should be made available.  The fact remains, the jab has a negligible effect on transmission.

That's the first time you have made sense to me and there is a recognition that different needs require different responses.  Anyone with any sense realises that with every medical intervention there is an element of risk, that cannot be denied hence the regime of reporting and recording any adverse effects both of which my one daughter and an elderly friend with a serious heart condition have been involved with. The jury is still out with Ivermectin. I have heard strong arguments that transmission is reduced by having the jab if for no other reason than the degree of illness is reduced. What frightens people in my view is the argument that we should do nothing but rely on natural immunity. This is just not reliable.
In fairness anyone who has had Covid should have the option of testing to see the strength of their immunity but once again the numbers understandably make this impossible. Thank you for a measured post which has cheered me up no end.

[Borchester]

So what's this then

https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/bulletins/deathsinvolvingcovid19byvaccinationstatusengland/deathsoccurringbetween2januaryand24september2021

Probably bullshit is the answer, but this is what the ONS are saying and PRESUMABLY forms the basis for what cromwell said .

Now I don't have time to take it apart now, - i might find time later.

I do note statements that the methods in this differ from other mortality documents and that raises my hackles for a start.

here is not a lot to examine.

Most everyone has had the jabs but the mortality bill keeps increasing, which suggests that the vaccination program is ft only to line my pea trench. I can't see that it is any use otherwise. Still, I doubt that it is killing anyone so I can live with it.