Cost of energy and the cost of living crisis.

[Thomas]

Maybe Boycey will tie them down while Smurphy cranks the handle.

i see the bbc are planning to do a new reinterpretation of snow white and the seven dwarfs....

[Sheepy]

thank christ we have you and pappy to keep us all straight boycey

Maybe Boycey will tie them down while Smurphy cranks the handle. 

[Thomas]

Everone wants Socialism @Thomas. But first they need to understand what it is. That is why I post.

thank christ we have you and pappy to keep us all straight boycey

[B0ycey]

Everone wants Socialism @Thomas. But first they need to understand what it is. That is why I post. The Scandinavians always poll high in standards of living and happiness and given they pay high taxes, people should wonder why that is.

[Thomas]

@Thomas, I am a Social Democrat which happens to be the same tag that the SNP are under.

Labour have been tagged as socialist , but i havent come across anyone who seriously thinks they are.

I can also just reference their manifesto which is based on high social spending on health and education and taxation on wealth

Sure there are probably parts of every single political parties manifestos that we all could cherry pick and say we like. That doesnt mean the party is "socialist".

I can also tell you the idea for Scotland is a move towards the Nordic model of economics which happens to be what I support.

many people support this , many dont. As ever it will depend on who is elected in an indy scotland at the ballot box . Thats the beauty of democracy , you can vote in any party you like and who suits your political views , and vote against those who dont.

I don't need to get on some wet dream that they are only about Independence because they have become a fully functional party with actual policies since they made in roads in politics and certainly since 2011

.Well if you know anything about scottish politics you will clearly know the party is nothing like today the party that won the 2011 election under salmond. Certainly the idea they are a "socialist party" is laughable. Like i said boycey , you seem to beleive your own left wing stereotypical nonsense and idealistic fantasy.

The SNP isn't the road to socialism I might add

aye we know. So what are you talking about? if they arent on the road to socialism which is what im telling you , how can they be similar to your line of political thinking as a socialist? Thats like arguing the BNP were similar to your line of thinking because they had left wing economic policies in thier manifesto.

Or it isn't the road for the UK.

a scottish national party isnt "the road for the uk "? Naw boycey ....never.! cant believe that .

And sure they are pro European, which I also am which you know. I am just pointing out that independence seems to have been fast forwarded since the SNP became popular in Scotland and there popularity isn't actually linked to nationalism but their policies.

their policies like GRA reform are universally disliked with two thirds of scots saying they dont support the snp on this. So what are you talking about?

https://scotgoespop.blogspot.com/search?updated-max=2021-12-22T23:12:00Z&max-results=10&start=10&by-date=false

And what I mean from that is the independence movement is growing in Scotland not because people have become nationalists like you but because they see what the SNP stands for and support that and want to get rid of the Tories

ah so scotland doesnt really want independence , just socialism ? Funny how every left wing englishman over many years tells me the same thing about what i and my countrymen want and support.

What happened then boycey? How come the socialists never get elected? I look across the uk and cant see a single socialist administration in power any where.

I keep telling you , you need to detract left wing fantasy and idealistic delusion and embrace reality mate.

And if that thinking is happening in Scotland, there is no reason to believe that won't happen to the rest of the UK. I am already reading on the Internet that people are seeing that Socialism reforms make sense and under hardship, that kind of thinking only grows. We are heading for a cost of living crisis and I don't see why anyone will just accept the Bourgeois sitting in their ivory towers when they can't heat their homes

up the revolution boycey.

The brothers and sisters are getting ready to fight !!

[papasmurf]

You won't be able to afford the electricity, Smurf.

It merely needs a hand cranked generator. 

[B0ycey]

@Thomas, I am a Social Democrat which happens to be the same tag that the SNP are under. I can also just reference their manifesto which is based on high social spending on health and education and taxation on wealth. I can also tell you the idea for Scotland is a move towards the Nordic model of economics which happens to be what I support. I don't need to get on some wet dream that they are only about Independence because they have become a fully functional party with actual policies since they made in roads in politics and certainly since 2011. The SNP isn't the road to socialism I might add. Or it isn't the road for the UK. And sure they are pro European, which I also am which you know. I am just pointing out that independence seems to have been fast forwarded since the SNP became popular in Scotland and there popularity isn't actually linked to nationalism but their policies. And what I mean from that is the independence movement is growing in Scotland not because people have become nationalists like you but because they see what the SNP stands for and support that and want to get rid of the Tories who they don't support. And if that means breaking the union so be it. And if that thinking is happening in Scotland, there is no reason to believe that won't happen to the rest of the UK. I am already reading on the Internet that people are seeing that Socialism reforms make sense and under hardship, that kind of thinking only grows. We are heading for a cost of living crisis and I don't see why anyone will just accept the Bourgeois sitting in their ivory towers when they can't heat their homes.

[Thomas]

As I have said Thomas, I am not interested in New Labour. Starmer is just a means to an end. In fact, the Party who is closest to my line of thinking is the SNP, which is why I have no issue with them.

You claim to be ( at different times on this forum) a left wing old style labour socialist  , and if you think the snp are a socialist party  ,then clearly you dont understand the meaning of the word "socialist" or understand the snp.

This isnt the time or the place to go massively in depth into snp history , but suffice to say the party was originally a liberal democrat party that basically supproted scottish independence , which was taken to the left slightly by the likes of salmond and sillars , expelled the ultr nationalist stypes like siol nan gaidheal , then since sturgeons coronation , has become a centrist party so much that many scottish mockingly refer to them as "the new snp " with clear reference to new labour.

Sturgeon herself is a pro european centrist  , friends with the likes of former new labour spin doctor alistair campbell , and is certainly no icon of socialism , who supports many of the policies of the free market you claim you hate .

Clearly  , you either dont know what you are talking about likening the snp to your socialist line of thinking , and alec slamonds "Alba" party are probably closer to socialism than the snp currently is.

But in any case, from the French revolution to the American. To the Chinese to the Russian. One thing I have learnt from history that the quickest way to see change is for people to suffer hardship.

Up the revolution boycey. !!! shall i call you citizen smith?

as you should know being Scottish, is that the popularity of the SNP in Scotland isn't down to just independence. It is because they are enacting Socialist targeted reforms.

Honestly boycey stope it. sounds to me you are merely repeating lazy english left wing stereotypes of socialist snp and communist scotland in the making.

The snp support by and large is behind them mainly because of scottish indy , and nothing more. Within the ranks of snp voters , there are people of all political persuasions and colours , united in the fact we all want an independent scotland out of the uk.

I dont want to see a socialist communist independent scotland. I want to see my country independent and normal like every other nation where the different political factions fight it out and i offer my vote to the highest bidder.

[B0ycey]

Let's windfall tax all the Tories mates who have just got rich out of the pandemic. That would pay for a lot of pension increases back up to the triple lock.

Well I support closing down loopholes Barry. As I say to people, the quickest and easiest way to stop embezzlement is to increase the threshold of income tax for the highest earners and to tax those bonuses which are shares. You need to tax the cash before it makes it into bank accounts to be sliced and diced into the channel Islands.

[Barry]

The whole point of a windfall tax is to get a large amount of revenue without the need for taxation. Do you think the idea of taxing energy companies who have just recorded record profits isn't popular to the public? It certainly would have more support than Sunaks loan. 

Let's windfall tax all the Tories mates who have just got rich out of the pandemic. That would pay for a lot of pension increases back up to the triple lock.

[Barry]

I am afraid there is a plague of cognitive dissonance on this forum.
I suspect the only cure for it is Electro Corrective Therapy.

You won't be able to afford the electricity, Smurf.

[B0ycey]

Keir starmers new labour are merely copying the age old soundbite politics of tony blair that were eventually seen through and dismissed.

Further , many in labour dont support nationalsation , while some tories like robert halfon have been calling for a windfall tax for ages. You are merely trumpeting labour party propaganda , and i wouldnt be surprised if starmer does get into power in two years time , that he backtracks and offers either a watered down version of his current windfall tax pledge , or doesnt inplement it at all.

As srb stev , former labour party member on this forum will tell you , starmer has already broken every fackin vow he made to get elected as labour leader including the very nationalisation we are talking about.

Wether all these things you talk about are popualr or not , there are no political parties likely to get elected in the near future at westminster to implement your socialist policies  you constantly scream about.

The last proper socialist manifesto i remember offered and completely rejected by the electorate was michael foots 1983 manifesto , and corbyns 2017 offering was fairly socialst , but it too was rejected.

So you say popualr , but not popular enough to get into power.

As i said , i and many like me will be voting against your despicable labour party at every point i can. No one is going to give starmer , the pro eurpean anti democrat the keys to number ten and risk him taking the uk back into europe , all for a few hollow empty promises and champagne socialism no one actually believes apart from you he will actually deliver.

As I have said Thomas, I am not interested in New Labour. Starmer is just a means to an end. In fact, the Party who is closest to my line of thinking is the SNP, which is why I have no issue with them. But in any case, from the French revolution to the American. To the Chinese to the Russian. One thing I have learnt from history that the quickest way to see change is for people to suffer hardship. It is the people who are united that will fast track change if they are not eating. Do you think the population is going to sit down and pay high energy prices whilst the Bourgeois sit there in their ivory towers. I don't know whether things will get bad enough that people will revolt. But what I do know is attitudes towards socialism will change and as it happens, as you should know being Scottish, is that the popularity of the SNP in Scotland isn't down to just independence. It is because they are enacting Socialist targeted reforms.

[Thomas]

The post wasn't about North Sea gas.

didnt you see the big words you wrote that i highlighted and sheepy replied to?

Quote from: B0ycey on February 04, 2022, 11:55:44 AM
Quote

They had to stop fracking. It was causing earthquakes. It wouldn't matter so much if we had vast open spaces. But if it means cities and towns falling into itself, it isn't really worth the fuel. Besides, there is more than enough gas in the North Sea to keep us warm if the idea is to be net zero in a decades time.

Sadly for you , everyone on the forum can actually read english boycey.

[Thomas]

The whole point of a windfall tax is to get a large amount of revenue without the need for taxation. Do you think the idea of taxing energy companies who have just recorded record profits isn't popular to the public? It certainly would have more support than Sunaks loan. But he has his reasons for not taking that route and that is because at this moment in time he wants to increase investment in North Sea gas. Green pledges have slowed investment down. Only now have the Tories understood the importance of extracting their own transitional gas before being net zero. Figures might look good if you buy from someone else. But it isn't without cost clearly.

As for Nationalisation, there is a book about revolution which telling you the importance of numbers. Not that I support violence of course. But I have noticed the more the cost of living goes up, the more people understand the logic of cooperation and the mistakes the Tories did by selling off the golden goose. And it isn't just gas after all that shouldn't have been privatised. So it will be people who will decide when to return to nationalise, not parties when the time is right.

Keir starmers new labour are merely copying the age old soundbite politics of tony blair that were eventually seen through and dismissed.

Further , many in labour dont support nationalsation , while some tories like robert halfon have been calling for a windfall tax for ages. You are merely trumpeting labour party propaganda , and i wouldnt be surprised if starmer does get into power in two years time , that he backtracks and offers either a watered down version of his current windfall tax pledge , or doesnt inplement it at all.

As srb stev , former labour party member on this forum will tell you , starmer has already broken every fackin vow he made to get elected as labour leader including the very nationalisation we are talking about.

Wether all these things you talk about are popualr or not , there are no political parties likely to get elected in the near future at westminster to implement your socialist policies  you constantly scream about.

The last proper socialist manifesto i remember offered and completely rejected by the electorate was michael foots 1983 manifesto , and corbyns 2017 offering was fairly socialst , but it too was rejected.

So you say popualr , but not popular enough to get into power.

As i said , i and many like me will be voting against your despicable labour party at every point i can. No one is going to give starmer , the pro eurpean anti democrat the keys to number ten and risk him taking the uk back into europe , all for a few hollow empty promises and champagne socialism no one actually believes apart from you he will actually deliver.

[B0ycey]

ok lets look at it again.

Quote from: B0ycey on February 04, 2022, 11:55:44 AM

yep you definetly mentioned north sea gas in that reply.

The post wasn't about North Sea gas. It was about fracking. The North sea reference is an after thought with absolutely no context to it whatsoever. If Sheepy wanted to talk about North Sea gas he should have either made that clear or highlight/cut the post. What you are doing is called an An- Hom . Picking one expect of something and attacking the use whilst ignoring the substance of the post. And given I would rather be taking about something else if you can't see that Sheepy fucked up I see absolutely no reason to explain that my post was about fracking when clearly it was. This is last time I will tell you that.