“Protocol continues to cause significant issues for medicine supplies” Cameron

[GerryT]

We are not talking about regular VAT, we are talking things on the exhaustive list and the EU made us put 5% VAT on it.

I was responding to Streetwalker who linked this

https://facts4eu.org/news/2022_feb_eu_deal_day#

There's a claim in there that the reason Sunak didn't cut the VAT on energy bills was because of NI and the EU.  I pointed out this was a lie, not that I think Sunak blamed the EU, but that the BrexitFacts link had made it up. I hear you shudder, nobody in the UK would falsely blame the EU on something.  The UK energy VAT rate is 20%, if Sunak wanted to reduce the VAT by 5% (as promised) then he can or could, no EU restriction.

You have introduced "exhaustive list" which is something I'm not aware of. But it's not what was being discussed. So what is this "exhaustive list".

[Nick]

So I point out that your Govt is blaming TODAY the EU on stopping the UK from reducing it's VAT rate and I show you that's a Lie, and all you hear is bla bla the EU is telling us what to do.

When you were an EU member, you made these rules, you weren't told to do anything. You jointly came up with all Eu regulations. Is that what you have a problem with, joint decision making. It's either rule everyone or nothing in your book.

The fact that the UK VAT rates are over 5% higher in most cases than EU minimum doesn't register ?  the UK wants to reduce their 20% rate to 15 % and say they can't, show me the agreement between the UK and EU that stops them doing that, it doesn't exist

We are not talking about regular VAT, we are talking things on the exhaustive list and the EU made us put 5% VAT on it. 

[Thomas]

Anything moving from NI to Ireland and visa versa is fine. The issue is to stop the illegal contraband getting onto the island. For arguments sake, when the UK is full of chlorinated chicken and hormone beef, we'll be thankful then to Johnson for suggesting and agreeing the border in the Irish sea.

[GerryT]

As Nick has said the reason we left was to take control and set our own rules . 

The point with the Foie gras  is that it works both ways . You seem quite happy that an open border would allow Northern Ireland to import illegal contraband from Eire but then kick up a stink about customs controls going the other way

Anything moving from NI to Ireland and visa versa is fine. The issue is to stop the illegal contraband getting onto the island. For arguments sake, when the UK is full of chlorinated chicken and hormone beef, we'll be thankful then to Johnson for suggesting and agreeing the border in the Irish sea.

[GerryT]

Gerry still doesn't get it.

The major drivers when we voted out were sovereignty and immigration.

When the EU sends its people, they're not sending their best. They're not sending you. They're not sending you. They're sending people that have lots of problems, and they're bringing those problems with us. They're bringing drugs. They're bringing crime. They're rapists.

This is why we stuck up two fingers and now we're again leading the world. What exactly does Ireland lead the world in? [highlight]Tax avoidance?[/highlight]

London is pretty high in that area, far higher than Ireland. Using the british virgin islands works well for london. UK is 12 on the list but also occupies position 1, 2 3 and 8. Why else would the UK want to leave a regulated EU

[GerryT]

No, it is you who spout bullshit

About a year before Blair ran away giving Brown the hot seat, Brown made a huge show of getting on a Eurostar to go to Brussels to ask their permission to reduce VAT on energy bills.

It was all over the BBC, The Guardian, every Euro Arse Licker newspaper going.

He was told to f**k off and go home.

Strangely, none of the pro Eu media reported that.

Looks like the UK is still blaming the EU, even when there's nothing stopping the UK implementing their 5% proposed vat cut on energy.

[GerryT]

This says it all.

You reeling off rules about what the EU allowed the U.K. to do makes me sick. The U.K. is a sovereign nation and the fact you feel it necessary to tell us what we could do is the whole crux of the problem but you carry on being controlled.

So I point out that your Govt is blaming TODAY the EU on stopping the UK from reducing it's VAT rate and I show you that's a Lie, and all you hear is bla bla the EU is telling us what to do.

When you were an EU member, you made these rules, you weren't told to do anything. You jointly came up with all Eu regulations. Is that what you have a problem with, joint decision making. It's either rule everyone or nothing in your book.

The fact that the UK VAT rates are over 5% higher in most cases than EU minimum doesn't register ?  the UK wants to reduce their 20% rate to 15 % and say they can't, show me the agreement between the UK and EU that stops them doing that, it doesn't exist

[Streetwalker]

This is nonsense, and typical of the liar Johnson.

The UK general VAT rate is 20%, as an EU member it could have reduced VAT on energy fuels to 5%, So there is NOTHING stopping the UK from reducing VAT on energy fuels from 20% to 15%, absolutely nothing. That's a bare faced lie.
Now onto the point your making, GB can reduce all of it's VAT rates to 0% on everything if it wanted to. The EU has no say whatso ever in this regard. There is debate regarding NI, but no consensus, that NI would have to follow EU rules, as it's still within the single market, meaning it would have a lower limit of 5% VAT on energy fuels. This is still 15% below what is being charged and the promised 5% cut can be given.
What you need is a new breed of politician that stops lying
What you also need are better journalists that call out this bull.

As for foie gras, Cor Blimey  is this what we are focusing on. How many billions in foie gras are we talking about. Again if GB wants to ban it fire away. And if you want to ban it in NI you prob can, who would try stop you. The Ni protocol allows for the free movement of goods on the island, but where does it say the UK can't ban products for sale in NI.

As Nick has said the reason we left was to take control and set our own rules .  

The point with the Foie gras  is that it works both ways . You seem quite happy that an open border would allow Northern Ireland to import illegal contraband from Eire but then kick up a stink about customs controls going the other way 

[johnofgwent]

Gerry still doesn't get it.

The major drivers when we voted out were sovereignty and immigration.

When the EU sends its people, they're not sending their best. They're not sending you. They're not sending you. They're sending people that have lots of problems, and they're bringing those problems with us. They're bringing drugs. They're bringing crime. They're rapists.

This is why we stuck up two fingers and now we're again leading the world. What exactly does Ireland lead the world in? Tax avoidance?

Actually "they" are not sending us anyone.

"They" (which I presume is a euphemism for the EU's Decree Makers) are doing no more than removing your previous right to block the entry of non UK citizens into the UK.

But the scum running our country never wanted to control them anyway.

As soon as murder riot and mayhem in the newly formed Orange Free State achieved its objectives by causing the secession of the Orange Free State from the United Kingdom of Great Britain And (all) Ireland, traitors to this country operating in our government passed laws granting free passage of the beneficiaries of that murder, riot and mayhem into this country from the new Republic.

That set the precedent.

The fact is from the 1st Jan 1973 any citizen of any EEC member state was entitled to enter the UK to seek employment.

But from the 1st April that same year we were entitled to throw any who had not found paid employment back.

It has been that way ever since. The reality is Britain has had, from three months after the date we joined the EEC, the right to eject from our country any who came here seeking work and failed to find it inside three months.

Try finding how many we have thrown out and when you have, pop back and crow about it.

[HallowedBrexit]

Gerry still doesn't get it.

The major drivers when we voted out were sovereignty and immigration.

When the EU sends its people, they're not sending their best. They're not sending you. They're not sending you. They're sending people that have lots of problems, and they're bringing those problems with us. They're bringing drugs. They're bringing crime. They're rapists. 

This is why we stuck up two fingers and now we're again leading the world. What exactly does Ireland lead the world in? Tax avoidance?

[johnofgwent]

This is nonsense, and typical of the liar Johnson.

The UK general VAT rate is 20%, as an EU member it could have reduced VAT on energy fuels to 5%, So there is NOTHING stopping the UK from reducing VAT on energy fuels from 20% to 15%, absolutely nothing. That's a bare faced lie.
Now onto the point your making, GB can reduce all of it's VAT rates to 0% on everything if it wanted to. The EU has no say whatso ever in this regard. There is debate regarding NI, but no consensus, that NI would have to follow EU rules, as it's still within the single market, meaning it would have a lower limit of 5% VAT on energy fuels. This is still 15% below what is being charged and the promised 5% cut can be given.
What you need is a new breed of politician that stops lying
What you also need are better journalists that call out this bull.

As for foie gras, Cor Blimey  is this what we are focusing on. How many billions in foie gras are we talking about. Again if GB wants to ban it fire away. And if you want to ban it in NI you prob can, who would try stop you. The Ni protocol allows for the free movement of goods on the island, but where does it say the UK can't ban products for sale in NI.

No, it is you who spout bullshit

About a year before Blair ran away giving Brown the hot seat, Brown made a huge show of getting on a Eurostar to go to Brussels to ask their permission to reduce VAT on energy bills.

It was all over the BBC, The Guardian, every Euro Arse Licker newspaper going.

He was told to F@@@ off and go home.

Strangely, none of the pro Eu media reported that.

[Nick]

This is nonsense, and typical of the liar Johnson.

The UK general VAT rate is 20%, as an EU member it could have reduced VAT on energy fuels to 5%, So there is NOTHING stopping the UK from reducing VAT on energy fuels from 20% to 15%, absolutely nothing. That's a bare faced lie.
Now onto the point your making, GB can reduce all of it's VAT rates to 0% on everything if it wanted to. The EU has no say whatso ever in this regard. There is debate regarding NI, but no consensus, that NI would have to follow EU rules, as it's still within the single market, meaning it would have a lower limit of 5% VAT on energy fuels. This is still 15% below what is being charged and the promised 5% cut can be given.
What you need is a new breed of politician that stops lying
What you also need are better journalists that call out this bull.

As for foie gras, Cor Blimey  is this what we are focusing on. How many billions in foie gras are we talking about. Again if GB wants to ban it fire away. And if you want to ban it in NI you prob can, who would try stop you. The Ni protocol allows for the free movement of goods on the island, but where does it say the UK can't ban products for sale in NI.

This says it all. 

You reeling off rules about what the EU allowed the U.K. to do makes me sick. The U.K. is a sovereign nation and the fact you feel it necessary to tell us what we could do is the whole crux of the problem but you carry on being controlled. 

[GerryT]

No deal and a border in Ireland is the only way we will have Brexit . 

Today's the day to end the Protocol and to cut UK families' energy bills (facts4eu.org)

This is nonsense, and typical of the liar Johnson.

The UK general VAT rate is 20%, as an EU member it could have reduced VAT on energy fuels to 5%, So there is NOTHING stopping the UK from reducing VAT on energy fuels from 20% to 15%, absolutely nothing. That's a bare faced lie.
Now onto the point your making, GB can reduce all of it's VAT rates to 0% on everything if it wanted to. The EU has no say whatso ever in this regard. There is debate regarding NI, but no consensus, that NI would have to follow EU rules, as it's still within the single market, meaning it would have a lower limit of 5% VAT on energy fuels. This is still 15% below what is being charged and the promised 5% cut can be given.
What you need is a new breed of politician that stops lying
What you also need are better journalists that call out this bull.

As for foie gras, ffs is this what we are focusing on. How many billions in foie gras are we talking about. Again if GB wants to ban it fire away. And if you want to ban it in NI you prob can, who would try stop you. The Ni protocol allows for the free movement of goods on the island, but where does it say the UK can't ban products for sale in NI.

[GerryT]

I'm struggling to see a downside to much of that. What's Sinn Feins take on abortions given its roots in Irish Catholic Republicanism ??

To the best of my Knowledge they support abortion/gay marriage/the GFA/the Irish language act and they laughed at the cash for ash scandal. BUt in fairness abortion and gay marriage are also very personal issues, so you will most likely find in any party people that disagree.

But it is ironic that the DUP who want to pin themselves to the UK take an opposite stance on these issues. Like Brexit it is usually the older people that are against abortion or gay marriage and young people that support them. But that is a generalisation.

[Streetwalker]

No deal and a border in Ireland is the only way we will have Brexit .  

Today's the day to end the Protocol and to cut UK families' energy bills (facts4eu.org)