The EU SNP and much else

[B0ycey]

Well it'll be an uphill struggle to convince me,having worked in Germany and visited a few of our European neighbours I am happy to cooperate with them,be in a market with them (which is what we joined) it's the eurpean state and primacy I am against.

Always ready to have a civilised exchange though I sometimes try to see the funny side of things because the alternative would make you cry.

I'm clocking on a bit now but I want what's best for my country and following generations and IMO a european superstate is not the answer.

It should be said the idea of a European superstate isn't a certainty. But there is a lot of merit in sharing resources and not just a trade relationship. But even so, the idea of a more integrated Europe has its sceptics even on the continent. But when I discuss this, my response is always the same. As Europe and America diverge from geopolitics ambitions and China continues to grow, along with the threat of Russia, I don't see any other option for the EU but to build there own army. And the less dependence of America for security, the less influence America has on the continent. And when that happens the EU voice grows. At which point the UK really will be insignificant and then they have a choice to be Airstrip One or part of the voice in Europe. 

I guess what I am saying to you is not something that will change your mind. But something I believe will happen and when it does it will have UK support at home because by then people will understand the importance of a united Europe.

As for seeing the importance of the EU and working in Germany, I can tell you aren't a lost cause. I worked in France in my teens and it was when I did I appreciated the importance of our friends over the Channel. Perhaps that is why I have always seen myself as European. But can I ask, given the way Brexit has happened, the problems with the Irish Sea border and how trade has plummeted between us and the EU, is Brexit has you hoped it would be or do you feel let down?

[Thomas]

Nice figures Thomas. But I am struggling to work out what that has to do with what I posted.

im expanding on your point about starmers new labour being a means to an end , bojo in ruins and all the rest  , and im showing how scotlands obviosuly doesnt see starmer as a means to any end .

Reality versus idealistic fantasy? Member we talked about this earlier?

Sad all these little facts get inthe way of your otherwise spiffing pronouncements , but hey ho boycey. Up the revolution.

[B0ycey]

Scottish Parliament constituency ballot voting intentions:

SNP 47% (-1)
Labour 22% (-)
Conservatives 19% (-1)
Liberal Democrats 8% (+1)

Scottish Parliament regional list ballot voting intentions:

SNP 38% (-)
Labour 20% (-)
Conservatives 18% (-4)
Greens 12% (+1)
Liberal Democrats 9% (+2)
Alba 2% (+1)

Given the trajectory of recent GB-wide polls, it might have seemed inevitable that Labour would have built upon their second place in the last ComRes poll, but in fact their own vote share has remained static and the Tories have only dropped one point. The Tory decline is much more pronounced on the list ballot, but again Labour have not picked up any support.

Savanta ComRes poll, 14th-18th January 2021:



Should Scotland be an independent country?



Yes 50% (+2)
No 50% (-2)

Nice figures Thomas. But I am struggling to work out what that has to do with what I posted. 

[Thomas]

Well it'll be an uphill struggle to convince me,having worked in Germany and visited a few of our European neighbours I am happy to cooperate with them,be in a market with them (which is what we joined) it's the eurpean state and primacy I am against.

Always ready to have a civilised exchange though I sometimes try to see the funny side of things because the alternative would make you cry.

I'm clocking on a bit now but I want what's best for my country and following generations and IMO a european superstate is not the answer.

poor old boycey . You mean you arent convinced by his arguments cromwell?

[cromwell]

As for Cromwell, I can see he is a good lad. Do I think he fell for disinformation? Well, yeah I do. I would like to hope I can make him see the merits of rejoining but we will see. And if he listens to me he will learn a thing or two. And if not, I hope we can have civil conversation in our disagreement and I will always put up a good fight for the EU.

Well it'll be an uphill struggle to convince me,having worked in Germany and visited a few of our European neighbours I am happy to cooperate with them,be in a market with them (which is what we joined) it's the eurpean state and primacy I am against.

Always ready to have a civilised exchange though I sometimes try to see the funny side of things because the alternative would make you cry.

I'm clocking on a bit now but I want what's best for my country and following generations and IMO a european superstate is not the answer.

[Thomas]

I told you Starmer is a means to an end. There are plenty of Old Labour MPs on the back benchers. And depending on what the economy is like in the next GE will depend on how much influence they have. Because FYI, Corbyns manifesto was very popular last time when we weren't feeling the pinch. And the only reason people voted for the clown was because he was riding on his Brexit ticket and Corbyn sat on the fence. BoJo can't ride that now and he owns how the economy runs.

Scottish Parliament constituency ballot voting intentions:

SNP 47% (-1)
Labour 22% (-)
Conservatives 19% (-1)
Liberal Democrats 8% (+1)

Scottish Parliament regional list ballot voting intentions:

SNP 38% (-)
Labour 20% (-)
Conservatives 18% (-4)
Greens 12% (+1)
Liberal Democrats 9% (+2)
Alba 2% (+1)

Given the trajectory of recent GB-wide polls, it might have seemed inevitable that Labour would have built upon their second place in the last ComRes poll, but in fact their own vote share has remained static and the Tories have only dropped one point.  The Tory decline is much more pronounced on the list ballot, but again Labour have not picked up any support.

Savanta ComRes poll, 14th-18th January 2021:



Should Scotland be an independent country?



Yes 50% (+2)
No 50% (-2)

[Thomas]

I told you Starmer is a means to an end. There are plenty of Old Labour MPs on the back benchers. And depending on what the economy is like in the next GE will depend on how much influence they have. Because FYI, Corbyns manifesto was very popular last time when we weren't feeling the pinch. And the only reason people voted for the clown was because he was riding on his Brexit ticket and Corbyn sat on the fence. BoJo can't ride that now and he owns how the economy runs.

Aye ok boycey. Dont ever take up betting , i dont think your wallet could withstand the losses.

[B0ycey]

well i dont want to dampen your enthusiasm boycey , but im not sure keir starmers new labour are quite as radical as you need them to be to bring about the communist socialist revolution and turn engerlund into europes cuba.

I told you Starmer is a means to an end. There are plenty of Old Labour MPs on the back benchers. And depending on what the economy is like in the next GE will depend on how much influence they have. Because FYI, Corbyns manifesto was very popular last time when we weren't feeling the pinch. And the only reason people voted for the clown was because he was riding on his Brexit ticket and Corbyn sat on the fence. BoJo can't ride that now and he owns how the economy runs.

[Thomas]

But history has shown us hardship leads to change Thomas. I can't say that the cost of living crisis will turn the country to Social Democracy but what I can say is it will help. I could also point out that the youth voice is more left leaning, Corbyns supporters were the mainstream youth voice and that dialectical Materialism shows us that the base reshapes the superstructure in any case. The way we vote today, isn't the same as we voted after the war which isn't the same we voted before it. It wasn't a coincidence that Labour won the election despite Churchill leading us through the war and it shouldn't be a surprise if people vote for Social reforms during a cost of living crisis.

well i dont want to dampen your enthusiasm boycey , but im not sure keir starmers new labour are quite as radical as you need them to be to bring about the communist socialist revolution and turn engerlund into europes cuba.

[B0ycey]

yep i can see it now boycey , two more years , the revolution will be happening , labour will win the election, turn socialist, and take us all back into the EU.

I dont know who spins the bigger yarns , english tories or english lefties. They say shakespeare was the biggest bullshitter in history , but i tell ye , he has some hot competition today.

But history has shown us hardship leads to change Thomas. I can't say that the cost of living crisis will turn the country to Social Democracy but what I can say is it will help. I could also point out that the youth voice is more left leaning, Corbyns supporters were the mainstream youth voice and that dialectical Materialism shows us that the base reshapes the superstructure in any case. The way we vote today, isn't the same as we voted after the war which isn't the same we voted before it. It wasn't a coincidence that Labour won the election despite Churchill leading us through the war and it shouldn't be a surprise if people vote for Social reforms during a cost of living crisis.

[Thomas]

I am still waiting for the £350mn for the NHS Thomas. I see no reason to increase the NI when we are sitting on such a bonanza.

Citizen Smith was a TV program Thomas. I would rather read Marx.

As for Cromwell, I can see he is a good lad. Do I think he fell for disinformation? Well, yeah I do. I would like to hope I can make him see the merits of rejoining but we will see. And if he listens to me he will learn a thing or two. And if not, I hope we can have civil conversation in our disagreement and I will always put up a good fight for the EU.

yep i can see it now boycey , two more years , the revolution will be happening , labour will win the election, turn socialist, and take us all back into the EU.

I dont know who spins the bigger yarns , english tories or english lefties. They say shakespeare was the biggest bullshitter in history , but i tell ye , he has some hot competition today.

[Thomas]

Oh blimey Thomas I wish I'd picked another link now the beeb were merely referencing it like a lot of other media outlets.

It's funny you should say that I was looking at some Irish forums to see attitudes compared to Gerry who posts on here,this one
https://politics.ie/

They have a different attitude to covid threads to here see what a mod says

Well cromwell what can i say?

Arent we lucky to have such a kind hearted fellow citizen of this earth , coming on the forum to lecture us all on the error of our political ways from his ivory tower in the dublin?

He has restored my faith in the kindness and trustworthiness of humanity .

[B0ycey]

what do you think citizen smith? Did cromwell fall for disinformation when he voted for brexit and supported the dastardly farage and boris?

Its everywhere this disinformation , except on the english left , who as we all know are as pure as the driven snow and whiter than white.

I am still waiting for the £350mn for the NHS Thomas. I see no reason to increase the NI when we are sitting on such a bonanza.

Citizen Smith was a TV program Thomas. I would rather read Marx.

As for Cromwell, I can see he is a good lad. Do I think he fell for disinformation? Well, yeah I do. I would like to hope I can make him see the merits of rejoining but we will see. And if he listens to me he will learn a thing or two. And if not, I hope we can have civil conversation in our disagreement and I will always put up a good fight for the EU.

[Thomas]

I would like to say this was solely down to Covid Cromwell. But disinformation is everywhere. BoJo fell for disinformation when he claimed unemployment is down since the pandemic the other day because he read something that was to his liking. It doesn't mean it was right.

what do you think citizen smith? Did cromwell fall for disinformation when he voted for brexit and supported the dastardly farage and boris?

Its everywhere this disinformation , except on the english left , who as we all know are as pure as the driven snow and whiter than white.

[Sheepy]

I would like to say this was solely down to Covid Cromwell. But disinformation is everywhere. BoJo fell for disinformation when he claimed unemployment is down since the pandemic the other day because he read something that was to his liking. It doesn't mean it was right.

What we have today is an Internet full of links. I have lost count the amount of times on forums (not so much this one but on others) where someone's source for their opinion is a tweeter post. This policy doesn't address all disinformation but it does attack harmful content. I am not against free speech I might add. I don't have a problem with users saying they don't want to be vaccinated. What I do have a problem with is seeing links from BS.com that vaccines have no effect whatsoever or over playing the risks (which are at a million to one of some form of reaction not death) and then saying reliable sources are not to be trusted. I have always thought social media should be regulated at the same standards as publishers for the simple fact we shouldn't accept that conspiracy theories have the same weight of argument to it just because some loser has created a thread of nonsense facts that you can be linked.

All very black and white in Boycey world, just thinking aloud.