What is really happening in the Ukraine Conflict?

[Sampanviking]

Just for you John (and while I wait to find out what is really happening on the ground) Meme/Cartoon for the day

[johnofgwent]

Just put this out there,no surprise with the Italians or the French
https://ecfr.eu/publication/peace-versus-justice-the-coming-european-split-over-the-war-in-ukraine/

The least surprising thing was that Poland want Russia punished far more than they want "peace"

Hardly surprising given a)they know what it's like to be the western end of the iron curtain and b)if Putin makes sampanvikings day and exterminates the Ukraine and the Ukrainians Poland will be next.

[Sampanviking]

The fall of Lisichansk continues apace today with even more fog than yesterday.

The city is in an operational encirclement, the main roads out are either physically cut or under direct control by the Russians.
Quite a lot of footage today of Ukrainians trying to get out and literally running a gauntlet of Artillery Fire and Phosphorous bombs.

The Russians themselves are said to be already mounting an attack on the town of Siversk itself.
This is intriguing as Siversk is being announced by the Ukrainians as the Northern end of a new defensive line from Siversk to Baskhmut.
A lot of talk was of a force of some 20.000 Ukrainian troops digging in and fortifying this new line.
The clear inference is that these were fresh troops moving up from Slavansk to take these positions.
Others are now saying that a large part of this 20,000 is made up from the retreating Lisichansk Garrison. If so, this could be explosive as
a) Many of the Units in or trying to leave Lisichansk are said to be down to only 20% strength with morale fallen through the floor.
b) Many of these units may already be fixed by the Russians in Lisichansk and unable to get out.

Should this prove correct then the Siversk Bakhmut line will prove utterly ineffective and the Russians will just roll straight through it and on to Slavansk.
Guess we will see for sure over the next couple of days.

Slightly off topic but what the hell
Boris encounters Erdogan at the NATO summit
https://twitter.com/LeChouNews/status/1542468815933657089

[Scott777]

This sounds about right.  'NATO was in Ukraine since 2014' -  John J. Mearsheimer, political scientist.

https://t.me/TommyRobinsonNews/37010

[cromwell]

Just put this out there,no surprise with the Italians or the French
https://ecfr.eu/publication/peace-versus-justice-the-coming-european-split-over-the-war-in-ukraine/

[Sampanviking]

Very active at the moment and yes it does look as though the Garrison at Lisichansk is in full collapse and Rout back towards Siversk.
Graphic footage on the net shows the road out as another road of death.
Several thousand Ukrainian troops seem isolated in the South of the City after the Russians split it in half overnight.
Several Thousand more Ukrainian troops in the North of the City seem to be trying to get out, especially as Russian forces have crossed the Severo-donetsk river in force to the North of them.
Unclear if they are leaving on foot or trying to get their heavy weapons out.

Way its going it could all be over by the end of today!

[Barry]

Lithuania stopped Russia using their railway line to move goods to and from Kaliningrad. Apparently at the say so of the EU.
A hacking group gave an ultimatum to the Lithuanian government which was ignored. The Lithuanians were then cyber attacked, bring down over a thousand websites and important ones, at that. Communications, airports, courts.
The "hacking group" is obviously Russian attackers.
Will NATO consider this an attack on a member state?
If so, WW3 will be a step closer, and as much as no one wants a huge war, Russia/Putin have to be stopped, one way or another.

I hope everyone is ready to meet their maker. 

[Thomas]

...and you make no mention of Russian bombing of a busy shopping mall. I thought it was again war 'rules' to target civilians.

On paper it might be , but in the real world , civilians are normally the biggest death toll in any conflict. Ask the irish.

[Thomas]

Do you think that is a result of the Ukraine conflict, Thomas. Is it the bad Ruski's trying to get him out because he supports Z.

Could be barry. Boris and his tory party love a russian ruble , so we dont know how deep influence can be bought.

Lebedev said he knew the tories and johnson could be bought.....he just didnt realise how cheap an english peerage was. What price to replace a PM?

i take your point though . I was replying to borkies earlier post .

[Thomas]

Obviously don't understand the words "they used to"

heres what you wrote..

They're used to it,drove old bangers like lada and moskovich for years

Thats what i replied to.

[cromwell]

Convenient for Zelensky that he could use that whilst appearing on the TV screen at the G7.
Not that I'm cynical at all.

Could be that Scrotum is using it as a warning to the G7

[cromwell]

i dont know what russians drive , but according to reports it looks like lada , toyota and hyundai are quite popular , with pictures i have seen of moscow showing pretty good looking cars of decent quality. A far cry from the picture the west paints of russia in the media.

Mind when we were told at the world cup in 2018 by the media we would be seeing clapped out communist cities and dilapidated stadia? Then we saw sochi.

Russia doesnt look any different from many western areas to me. Of course i havent ever been there , but would like to visit both russia and china.

Obviously don't understand the words "they used to"

[Barry]

...and you make no mention of Russian bombing of a busy shopping mall. I thought it was again war 'rules' to target civilians.

Convenient for Zelensky that he could use that whilst appearing on the TV screen at the G7.
Not that I'm cynical at all. 

[T00ts]

...and you make no mention of Russian bombing of a busy shopping mall. I thought it was again war 'rules' to target civilians.

[Sampanviking]

Did I mention systemic rout from what is left of the Lughansk salient?

Commentators have been saying that with a effective tactical encirclement now enforce by the Russians, that the Ukrainian Army is Lisichansk (up to about 10,000 strong) will not be able to come out with there heavy weapons (some 700 pieces of Armour and artillery)
Footage released today showing Ukrainian troops moving on foot in large numbers through the countryside do little to dispel this impression

https://twitter.com/AZmilitary1/status/1541396929975914496