NHS in decline

[Streetwalker]

The current demands on GP services mean they can allocate a max of 10 min per consultation.

Seems to me perfectly reasonable to ask that you make individual appointments for athletes foot, eczema, migraine, tinnitus, etc.

But having said that, our GP appointment system allows us to include all symptoms, thus allowing the GP to judge if they're related...

There shouldn't be a time limit on consultations .  It should be up to the GP to decide if a sore throat is worth less time than a suspected heart attack . If we had decent GP's of course . 

[patman post]

Tell me about it  Niether do I but the receptionist isn't someone I want to discuss my health with . The quack wont even talk about multiple issues . Ive tried it their way and it quickly falls apart

Whats the reason for requesting an appointment
Arthritis
Thank you
Hang on there is something else
You will have to make another appointment  ,saving time , not .

The current demands on GP services mean they can allocate a max of 10 min per consultation.

Seems to me perfectly reasonable to ask that you make individual appointments for athletes foot, eczema, migraine, tinnitus, etc.

But having said that, our GP appointment system allows us to include all symptoms, thus allowing the GP to judge if they're related...

[T00ts]

You dont use the same quacks as me do you ?

I'd laugh if it wasn't so dismal! 

[Streetwalker]

Absolutely. If you took the car to the garage they would run a diagnostics test to find what is going on - go to the doctor and he/she is not able to look at the whole person. Symptoms cross over ailments but my doctors' surgery has become a triage for the hospital. It seems that if it's a basic pill they can cope but otherwise it's a referral. Add to that the inability to see the same doctor, and they don't seem able to read notes, other than the prompts to dish out the umbrella remedies for all - for a reward - so that there is no continuity, hardly any recognition of who you are or what has gone before.
eg a few months ago I had an insect bite on an ankle. A couple of months later it didn't look right. See the nurse they said. 2 weeks later she looked and panicked and called the doctor to see me. He looked foxed. Got his magnifier out, took photos and sent them to the dermatologist. He even got me back for another set of photos after using the prescribed antibiotic cream to see if it had changed.
I gave up at this point and used a fairly radical home remedy - here we are and it is fine. I emailed the surgery to call off the attack dogs at the hospital and 2 weeks later the doc calls wanting to have another look asking what I did to it! There's nothing to see - 'can you come in next week'. I despair.

You dont use the same quacks as me do you ?

[patman post]

You all do seem to be badly served by your local NHS services.

Here, health services mostly seem to be operated by City & Hackney activities. And they operate well. Plus there are various other activities like Hoxton Health charities that include family dental services and foot care.

Luckily, we've had little need of any services other than pregnancy — after which I got my figure back fairly quickly — and kiddy medications and various family vaccinations, some even administered on Sundays!!!

If your local health services are as bad as you all appear to be saying, can you not approach your councillors, local health boards and/or local health trusts and badger them to get improvements...?

[T00ts]

You have a good point. Multiple symptoms can be an aid to diagnosis of a disease that is calling all of them. However, once speaking to a doctor, they should explore other symptoms before prescribing you some pills.

Absolutely. If you took the car to the garage they would run a diagnostics test to find what is going on - go to the doctor and he/she is not able to look at the whole person. Symptoms cross over ailments but my doctors' surgery has become a triage for the hospital. It seems that if it's a basic pill they can cope but otherwise it's a referral. Add to that the inability to see the same doctor, and they don't seem able to read notes, other than the prompts to dish out the umbrella remedies for all - for a reward - so that there is no continuity, hardly any recognition of who you are or what has gone before. 
eg a few months ago I had an insect bite on an ankle. A couple of months later it didn't look right. See the nurse they said. 2 weeks later she looked and panicked and called the doctor to see me. He looked foxed. Got his magnifier out, took photos and sent them to the dermatologist. He even got me back for another set of photos after using the prescribed antibiotic cream to see if it had changed. 
I gave up at this point and used a fairly radical home remedy - here we are and it is fine. I emailed the surgery to call off the attack dogs at the hospital and 2 weeks later the doc calls wanting to have another look asking what I did to it! There's nothing to see - 'can you come in next week'. I despair.

[Barry]

Tell me about it  Niether do I but the receptionist isn't someone I want to discuss my health with . The quack wont even talk about multiple issues . Ive tried it their way and it quickly falls apart

Whats the reason for requesting an appointment
Arthritis
Thank you
Hang on there is something else
You will have to make another appointment  ,saving time , not .

You have a good point. Multiple symptoms can be an aid to diagnosis of a disease that is causing all of them. However, once speaking to a doctor, they should explore other symptoms before prescribing you some pills.

EDITED typo calling causing

[Streetwalker]

You do seem particularly badly served.

Tell me about it  

Booking online asks for reason for requesting consultation — same with phone request, I guess. But I don't see a problem with saving time...

Niether do I but the receptionist isn't someone I want to discuss my health with . The quack wont even talk about multiple issues . Ive tried it their way and it quickly falls apart 

Whats the reason for requesting an appointment 
Arthritis 
Thank you
Hang on there is something else 
You will have to make another appointment  ,saving time , not .

[patman post]

You do seem particularly badly served.

For us, the call-back from the GP is mostly the same day — or the day after if booked after 19.30 — the GP is operational 08:00 to 19:30 Sunday to Friday. Closed Saturday. There's also an NHS walk-in at the local hospital. Not bad for London, which has among the highest number of patients per one GP in England.

Booking online asks for reason for requesting consultation — same with phone request, I guess. But I don't see a problem with saving time...

[Streetwalker]

I don't know your circumstances but, from our limited experience of the local GP, you sound an odd-ball.

Odd-ball , strange or ecentric , thats one to add to the list . 

If we want to consult our GP we book a phone call with the doctor at a specific time.

Yep same here , it will be normally be within 2 weeks 

He/she phones back within a few minutes of that time, and either advises over the call, or makes a face-to-face appointment for that same day.

With our practice we get a call from the receptionist asking what exactly the problem is .  I normally tell her to mind her own bloody business and that I want to speak to the quack ,with which another appointment is made ......another couple of days at least .
Face to face are hit and miss , the practice has a number of GP's ,one is decent when she is there the others are basically students that either rely on the internet for diagnosis or send you off to the hospital to see someone who knows what they are talking about which is another 3 months down the line 

So far, all has worked well. Even prescriptions are emailed directly to our chosen pharmacy, which texts us to say if ready for collection — it'll even deliver should we be house-bound...

Yes we get all that , but they even manage to feck that up at times sending out texts saying its ready when the doctor hasn't even signed it off 

[patman post]

It is the same old Tory destabilisation of a public service by stealth so that their rich mates can take over a privatised entity after public confidence has been eroded sufficiently to make it politically possible.

Chronic underfunding, assisted by chronic staff shortages - this latter aided and abetted by terrible working conditions and ever worsening real terms pay by government diktat - is all leading to an NHS on it's needs. Then the authors of this sorry situation will say that the NHS is clearly not fit for purpose, privatisation and charging is the only answer. And if and when they get away with that, they and their rich friends will be making billions out of it whilst the rest of us pay a lot more for a lot less. We've seen the way it works with other privatised entities.

They did the same with British Rail. The NHS  though is a much tougher nut for them to crack since it  commands a lot of public support for remaining a publicly owned entity free at the point of use. Such public support needs to be undermined by stealth by gradually turning the NHS into a basket case via constant meddling, staff  shortages and chronic underfunding, the aim being to undermine public support for it in it's current form. They cannot rush this process though because it will not work if the public starts to blame the government more than it blames the existing NHS set up. But the final destination in terms of aims is clear.

Can't disagree with your appraisal of much of the current NHS. But I don't agree that it's all a Tory plot.

Most of my views on the NHS are drawn from conversations with my mother. She is a senior nursing sister, on a salary akin to tube a drivers (despite probably working twice as many hours), and is only a few years away from retirement. But following the stress of the pandemic, and her current working conditions, I guess she may opt for early retirement or transfer.

Neither of the political parties has adequately or intelligently administered and funded either the NHS or the railways. Different governments put forward their pet reforms, either with or against the unions (or the unions tried to push their own dogma — a bit like education, really). The result is that essential public services are crumbling, while all the interested parties (stakeholders?) squabble over dogma and funds.

Reform and overhaul is long overdue. But who would be able to do it? Such a role would need a general manager able to command a group of managers skilled in health provision, finance & purchasing, HR, resource allocation, research, etc — but all at arm's length from government...

[srb7677]

It is the same old Tory destabilisation of a public service by stealth so that their rich mates can take over a privatised entity after public confidence has been eroded sufficiently to make it politically possible.

Chronic underfunding, assisted by chronic staff shortages - this latter aided and abetted by terrible working conditions and ever worsening real terms pay by government diktat - is all leading to an NHS on it's needs. Then the authors of this sorry situation will say that the NHS is clearly not fit for purpose, privatisation and charging is the only answer. And if and when they get away with that, they and their rich friends will be making billions out of it whilst the rest of us pay a lot more for a lot less. We've seen the way it works with other privatised entities.

They did the same with British Rail. The NHS  though is a much tougher nut for them to crack since it  commands a lot of public support for remaining a publicly owned entity free at the point of use. Such public support needs to be undermined by stealth by gradually turning the NHS into a basket case via constant meddling, staff  shortages and chronic underfunding, the aim being to undermine public support for it in it's current form. They cannot rush this process though because it will not work if the public starts to blame the government more than it blames the existing NHS set up. But the final destination in terms of aims is clear.

[patman post]

Its not in decline Toots its no longer fit for purpose and needs sripping back to the bare minimum and starting again in a different format as Its now run for its own benefit not ours
Like you Im getting call backs to discuss x-rays I had 2 years ago and like you Im not dead yet so I guess there was nothing too serious going on that I didnt know about .
Scott has a point ,it was covid  but not so much the testing but the  NHS saw it was far easier for them to deal with the public over the phone . I have been diagnosed with all sorts through phone calls which I have basically ignored having better advice from the local publican ,Chemist and a bit of self diagnosis by Google .

Yes the NHS is knackered and personally I send any family member with a problem straight to a private specialist . Its probably the same doctor/surgeon  you would end up seeing through the NHS but it saves you 3 years of phone calls and the NHS reams of paperwork

I don't know your circumstances but, from our limited experience of the local GP, you sound an odd-ball.

If we want to consult our GP we book a phone call with the doctor at a specific time.

He/she phones back within a few minutes of that time, and either advises over the call, or makes a face-to-face appointment for that same day.

So far, all has worked well. Even prescriptions are emailed directly to our chosen pharmacy, which texts us to say if ready for collection — it'll even deliver should we be house-bound...

[Borchester]

. I have been diagnosed with all sorts through phone calls which I have basically ignored having better advice from the local publican ,Chemist and a bit of self diagnosis by Google .

Bit off topic, but every teacher I know has his or her children educated privately

[Streetwalker]

I had a letter a couple of days ago to say that a hospital test had been requested for me.

Back Story - I had a bit of an emergency and they ran tests. I saw the Specialist and he ordered more. Then Covid hit and all lines went dead. Eventually I heard that I could book the missing test and decided not to bother. It seemed a bit daft to have lived without a problem for just over 2 years to rock up again when they keep telling us they can't cope.
A while later after I had forgotten about it the specialist wrote to me honouring my decision and confirming what he had found which I already knew.

I rang the dedicated line back yesterday and after listening a great list of what I could and could not leave as a message I told them not to bother as I had been discharged. Yesterday I had 2 missed calls from the reply service - no message left.

So someone hasn't discharged me on the system. When are they going to become competent, sort out their IT system and stop wasting everyone's money?

Oh and another thing - someone has suggested that everyone pay £8 per day while in hospital, we pay for our GP appointments and everyone over 60 pay for prescriptions! It would be nice if we could just see a doctor when we needed one.

Its not in decline Toots its no longer fit for purpose and needs sripping back to the bare minimum and starting again in a different format as Its now run for its own benefit not ours
Like you Im getting call backs to discuss x-rays I had 2 years ago and like you Im not dead yet so I guess there was nothing too serious going on that I didnt know about .
Scott has a point ,it was covid  but not so much the testing but the  NHS saw it was far easier for them to deal with the public over the phone . I have been diagnosed with all sorts through phone calls which I have basically ignored having better advice from the local publican ,Chemist and a bit of self diagnosis by Google . 

Yes the NHS is knackered and personally I send any family member with a problem straight to a private specialist . Its probably the same doctor/surgeon  you would end up seeing through the NHS but it saves you 3 years of phone calls and the NHS reams of paperwork