Workers suffer record pay slump in face of rocketing inflation

[cromwell]

You're absolutely crackers off you think the public get what they want. They get what the tech giants say they get. VCR in the early 80's, who'd even heard of one until you were told you wanted one. The supermarkets will move as one as they always have and ween you onto what ever they choose, same as a puppy onto solids.

And I over react,basically you're saying people are idiots.

And the miners as they once again tried to hold a country to ransom.

you mean they grew from being puppies and turned to attack dogs,scargill was a knob but wasn't wrong about their ultimate aim.

Close the mines break (which they denied was the policy ) the miners and you control the proles,but now theprles see the the crap and and want change.

[Good old]

Do you believe making the rich poorer makes the poor richer?

No, it's nowhere near as simple as that.
This country likes itself to be known as one of the wealthiest in the world, and so it is, but if that wealth is not being made to work  in achieving an acceptable outcome for all the people of this country then being a wealthy country is of little help in making the peoples of this country able to maintain the semblance of actually benefiting fully from this countries wealth. Right now  the poor are expected to not keep up with inflationary costs. And beyond that vital services such as health are in dire straights, End of. It's not the whole story by any means but the wealthy probably increase inflation because in most cases they reward themselves well beyond the accepted inflation rate.
There are a number of third world countries that are wealthy, and we could easily slip to that if the established attitudes are not amended soon.

[cromwell]

A massive overreaction there. Firstly nobody is laughing a Steve, I'm just pointing out that pay rises do almost nothing to improve peoples lot, it has to be a positive push forward or anything gained is negated by external forces.

Overreaction,ha so the utilities privatised are a success.....yes or no?.

Is it fair people like Steve don't get a paid break......yes or no?

[cromwell]

That's your heart telling your head what it wants to hear. It may not even be self service tills, it might go straight to no tills like the smart stores in London.

You mean like the Amazon grocery store,they're not doing anymore,people don't like them.

[B0ycey]

Just how sustainable it might be is yet to be tested this century, but to keep applying the theory that to maintain the true wellbeing of any country all that need happen is for the general working public to go without , whilst a select percentage continue to defy inflation by not going without anything significant to their overall comforts.
The working classes do not run this country, they are not responsible for the condition of this countries economy, the price of virtually anything, inflation.  Yet they are expected to make the sacrifices for those that do run the show, those that  are expected to deal with the problems landed on the populace, and in many cases actually profit from the added costs to Joe soap.  The next two three years are going to test the stability of this country  who ever is running the ship will need the people with them and that will not happen if present attitudes are not adjusted to prevent a large section of society becoming alienated because they are not prevented from falling into poverty by modern first world standards.

Although I agree that inflation isn't exactly going to effect everyone equally and the poor are going to have to sacrifice the most, what is it you think that can be done? The truth is the UK doesn't have much gas reserves and sooner or later Europe will be buying from the same sources as us. Russia might only be sending them 20% capacity now but eventually that will be 0% and I don't see how even the EU storage capacity is going to be sustainable after the winter.

What I am fed up of reading is that we can ride this out by pay increases or handouts when the underlining issue is supply and demand. I am all for Unions demanding inflation matching pay rises and companies realigning pay and profits so workers get a fair deal, but one thing Nick is absolutely right about is increasing the money supply in the market will make inflation worse. Liz Truss is probably the most dangerous woman on the planet right now for the Brits. Her tax cuts not only will make inflation worse but it also reduces the amount the state picks up in revenue to offer targeted support. And that isn't even getting into the technicalities of national debt and borrowing that will lead with tax cuts for the rich and not much else.

The truth is we either cut our gas consumption by 50% or we buy Russian gas. There is simply no other way to stop inflation right now. And unless you are asking for a negotiation ending for this war when previous you weren't, there is nothing the government can do to stop inflation. There simply isn't a substitute for Russian gas and every Western nation is buying from the same sources. We even had to buy Australian gas because we had no where else to go and it isn't even the Winter yet.

[Nick]

Just how sustainable it might be is yet to be tested this century, but to keep applying the theory that to maintain the true wellbeing of any country all that need happen is for the general working public to go without , whilst a select percentage continue to defy inflation by not going without anything significant to their overall comforts.
The working classes do not run this country, they are not responsible for the condition of this countries economy, the price of virtually anything, inflation.  Yet they are expected to make the sacrifices for those that do run the show, those that  are expected to deal with the problems landed on the populace, and in many cases actually profit from the added costs to Joe soap.  The next two three years are going to test the stability of this country  who ever is running the ship will need the people with them and that will not happen if present attitudes are not adjusted to prevent a large section of society becoming alienated because they are not prevented from falling into poverty by modern first world standards.

Do you believe making the rich poorer makes the poor richer?

[Good old]

Just how sustainable it might be is yet to be tested this century, but to keep applying the theory that to maintain the true wellbeing of any country all that need happen is for the general working public to go without , whilst a select percentage continue to defy inflation by not going without anything significant to their overall comforts.
The working classes do not run this country, they are not responsible for the condition of this countries economy, the price of virtually anything, inflation.  Yet they are expected to make the sacrifices for those that do run the show, those that  are expected to deal with the problems landed on the populace, and in many cases actually profit from the added costs to Joe soap.  The next two three years are going to test the stability of this country  who ever is running the ship will need the people with them and that will not happen if present attitudes are not adjusted to prevent a large section of society becoming alienated because they are not prevented from falling into poverty by modern first world standards.

[Nick]

With Covid we have had an unreal economic situation. You cannot count those years. Many were furloughed, many now work from home - they will get hit bigtime when heating costs an arm and a leg come Winter. Clamouring for pay rises to counteract inflation is unreasonable and will never succeed. Bosses have to look to next year and the year after and protect the entire business before they can dole out cash willy nilly. There have been offers but as I have repeated the aim is the Government and playing on the current fears of the workers.

People said the government reneged on its Triple lock policy because as people went from 80% furlough back onto full wages they said salaries had increased by 20%, therefore pensions should increase by 20%. Absolute lunacy b

[Nick]

The problem is that if you keep on going on strike then pretty soon the boss finds some way of doing the job without you, which just means you end up getting poorer faster.

The printers and dockers spring to mind.

And the miners as they once again tried to hold a country to ransom. 

[Nick]

It is all down to what the public wants.

You're absolutely crackers off you think the public get what they want. They get what the tech giants say they get. VCR in the early 80's, who'd even heard of one until you were told you wanted one. The supermarkets will move as one as they always have and ween you onto what ever they choose, same as a puppy onto solids. 

[Borchester]

Not experiencingh yet more de facto pay cuts when profits, dividends and CEO pay is soaring is not an unreasonable request.

Yet you seem to find this as outrageous. Do you actually think we should all accept getting poorer year after year? Because if you think thzt is reasonable you are out of touch and in for a shock and inviting an economic collapse. Greed will come back and bite the greedy here but they don't seem to care.

The problem is that if you keep on going on strike then pretty soon the boss finds some way of doing the job without you, which just means you end up getting poorer faster.

The printers and dockers spring to mind.

[T00ts]

Real terms pay cuts year after year causes hardship does it not? Where does it end? Eventually workers need to stand and fight. Or do you think that everyone getting ever poorer in perpetuity is reasonable? How poor do we all have to get before you acknowledge that something unreasonable is happening? Perhaps your income should be cut year after year and see how you like it. We are the ones doing all the work and paying the taxes for you so you can sit pretty whilst advocating impoverishment for us. It stinks and we will not stand for it.

If you want working people to suffer real terms pay cuts year after year, then accept it for yourself or reveal yourself to be an I'm all right jack hypocrite

With Covid we have had an unreal economic situation. You cannot count those years. Many were furloughed, many now work from home - they will get hit bigtime when heating costs an arm and a leg come Winter. Clamouring for pay rises to counteract inflation is unreasonable and will never succeed. Bosses have to look to next year and the year after and protect the entire business before they can dole out cash willy nilly. There have been offers but as I have repeated the aim is the Government and playing on the current fears of the workers.

[srb7677]

It's all relative Steve, what you see is from your perspective. If you had a £1800 a month mortgage, £700 car payment and all the other bills that are on a scale exponentially higher than yours you may have a different perspective. Not once have you ever acknowledged this, maybe you think they have no right to  e successful and live life at a higher level than others?

I fully accept that people with higher earnings often have higher outgoings. But spending 700 on a car is a choice and not a necessity. No one actually needs to spend that much on a car. It is a choice they make.

Besides which, I am happy to acknowledge that but such levels are not anywhere near CEO levels.

[srb7677]

No it isn't. Striking to twist everyone's arms causing hardship to all is unreasonable.

Real terms pay cuts year after year causes hardship does it not? Where does it end? Eventually workers need to stand and fight. Or do you think that everyone getting ever poorer in perpetuity is reasonable? How poor do we all have to get before you acknowledge that something unreasonable is happening? Perhaps your income should be cut year after year and see how you like it. We are the ones doing all the work and paying the taxes for you so you can sit pretty whilst advocating impoverishment for us. It stinks and we will not stand for it.

If you want working people to suffer real terms pay cuts year after year, then accept it for yourself or reveal yourself to be an I'm all right jack hypocrite

[Nick]

Not experiencingh yet more de facto pay cuts when profits, dividends and CEO pay is soaring is not an unreasonable request.

Yet you seem to find this as outrageous. Do you actually think we should all accept getting poorer year after year? Because if you think thzt is reasonable you are out of touch and in for a shock and inviting an economic collapse. Greed will come back and bite the greedy here but they don't seem to care.

It's all relative Steve, what you see is from your perspective. If you had a £1800 a month mortgage, £700 car payment and all the other bills that are on a scale exponentially higher than yours you may have a different perspective. Not once have you ever acknowledged this, maybe you think they have no right to  e successful and live life at a higher level than others?