How is everyone doing ?

[Streetwalker]

World inflation is due to coming out of the failed covid lockdown idea.

It has had an effect for sure but make no mistake we are all in an economic war with Russia . Sanctions that were meant to hurt Russians ability to finance its war will become two way sanctions that hurt the west as much as it does them . Everyone is skint , governments and people alike we are all on borrowed time ,  

winter is coming 

[Benson]

Ukraine war: How has Russia's invasion changed Europe? | Euronews

As the war in Ukraine goes past its 6 month anniversary it seems most are paying through inflation and soaring prices

Will this lead to less support for Ukraine as countries turn their attention to fixing their own economies is anyones guess but outgoing PM Johnson has told us to basically stop moaning ,its only a few quid . Ukraine are paying in blood .

World inflation is due to coming out of the failed covid lockdown idea.

[Streetwalker]

Russia aren't going to go back Streetwalker. Ukraine have two choices, they can continue to fight until the last Ukrainian or they can talk. They longer it takes to talk the weaker their position is because to regain ground means you are taking the fight on and defacto on the back foot. The whole point of talking is to find common ground anyway and not have things on "your terms". Russia will demand certain things because NOBODY goes to the negotiation table saying they are going to concede. The truth is Erdoğan is setting the foundations for talks to resume and if Zelensky is asking for troops to withdraw first it will be Ukraibe not Russia who will need convincing to come back to the table.

But to answer your question previously on what is needed to get Russia back to the negotiation table, the first is to ask for a realistic framework to negotiate. Personally I would ask for talks to be split into criteria that are mutually beneficial, the first being a ceasefire which will remain in back until a solution for the Donbass is reached and then move onto negotiating Ukraine/Russian security, withdrawal of troop and finally Crimea. If we can at least agree a ceasefire and start talks we will be making progress don't you think?

Yes I do . Europe, in particular those who rely on Russian gas are getting cold feet with the sanctions and Russia knows now not to push it .  Russia cant be seen to have 'won' anything but maybe independence for those who want it 

[B0ycey]

The Russians will only talk on their terms as will Ukraine which doesnt bode well for the future . The minsk agreement gave self governance to some regions , it didnt move the Ukraine border .
But yes something needs to give  and Russia getting back on their side of the fence with possibly a peacekeeping force moving into the disputed areas would be a start

Russia aren't going to go back Streetwalker. Ukraine have two choices, they can continue to fight until the last Ukrainian or they can talk. They longer it takes to talk the weaker their position is because to regain ground means you are taking the fight on and defacto on the back foot. The whole point of talking is to find common ground anyway and not have things on "your terms". Russia will demand certain things because NOBODY goes to the negotiation table saying they are going to concede. The truth is Erdoğan is setting the foundations for talks to resume and if Zelensky is asking for troops to withdraw first it will be Ukraibe not Russia who will need convincing to come back to the table. 

But to answer your question previously on what is needed to get Russia back to the negotiation table, the first is to ask for a realistic framework to negotiate. Personally I would ask for talks to be split into criteria that are mutually beneficial, the first being a ceasefire which will remain in back until a solution for the Donbass is reached and then move onto negotiating Ukraine/Russian security, withdrawal of troop and finally Crimea. If we can at least agree a ceasefire and start talks we will be making progress don't you think?

[Streetwalker]

They have already signaled they are prepared to talk. Getting Russia to the table isn't the problem. The problem is Zelensky has demanded that Russia retreat to where they were in February before they start to talk again which won't happen. Russia have already said numerous times this war can end tomorrow if Zelensky pretty much accept the terms they agreed to when a deal had been made as Russia retreated away from Keiv and Ukraine then screamed warcrimes and weltched. Russia clearly aren't going to fall from the same mistake twice. They aren't going to withdraw from the Donbass. And at the moment it seems they are now holding ground and it is up to Ukraine to take the fight on which means they are going to start sacrificing men over the trenches. Not to mention Winter is coming.

But in any case, all I will say is that an autonomous Donbass region is merely the Minsk II agreement, it doesn't mean Ukraine has to give up any territory and it solves the civil war issue. It isn't a win for anyone to compromise. So rather than speaking shit and saying  Ukraine can win this or that any other solution except a compromise is even possible and to save lives whether that is Ukrainians or Russians over a needless conflict, we instead should be encouraging talks not just because of the cost of living crisis but because it is the only solution to this.

The Russians will only talk on their terms as will Ukraine which doesnt bode well for the future . The minsk agreement gave self governance to some regions , it didnt move the Ukraine border .
But yes something needs to give  and Russia getting back on their side of the fence with possibly a peacekeeping force moving into the disputed areas would be a start 

[B0ycey]

All very true Boycey but how do you suggest  Russia is brought to the table ?

They have already signaled they are prepared to talk. Getting Russia to the table isn't the problem. The problem is Zelensky has demanded that Russia retreat to where they were in February before they start to talk again which won't happen. Russia have already said numerous times this war can end tomorrow if Zelensky pretty much accept the terms they agreed to when a deal had been made as Russia retreated away from Keiv and Ukraine then screamed warcrimes and weltched. Russia clearly aren't going to fall from the same mistake twice. They aren't going to withdraw from the Donbass. And at the moment it seems they are now holding ground and it is up to Ukraine to take the fight on which means they are going to start sacrificing men over the trenches. Not to mention Winter is coming. 

But in any case, all I will say is that an autonomous Donbass region is merely the Minsk II agreement, it doesn't mean Ukraine has to give up any territory and it solves the civil war issue. It isn't a win for anyone to compromise. So rather than speaking shit and saying  Ukraine can win this or that any other solution except a compromise is even possible and to save lives whether that is Ukrainians or Russians over a needless conflict, we instead should be encouraging talks not just because of the cost of living crisis but because it is the only solution to this.

[Streetwalker]

A millionaire telling someone to stop moaning is someone who has had a silver spoon stuck in his ass his whole life and doesn't understand the wealth divide. Poverty has been a problem far longer than six months. And now the situation is going to be made a lot worse. Why should anyone stop moaning when they have been moaning for years? The truth is Ukraine has been in state of civil war since the Orange revolution. Where the war is today is in contested lands. If Zelensky thinks the war will end once the Russians pulls out means they are also defecto implying they are also going to push out Ukrainians out of their own land too. The Ukrainians right now are paying with blood but they do so because they believe LPR and DPR, who are Ukrainians, don't have any rights in terms of their language or political affiliation. Are you aware that Zelensky is criminalising opposition parties for supporting Russia despite many residents in the Donbass speaking Russian as their main language? The solution for the Donbass is autonomy. A split parliament very much like NI. And you can solve that by negotiation between Russia and Ukraine. Compromise is the only solution today not just for the cost of living crisis but also for sustaining peace in Ukraine. So BoJo, your wrong again. Ukraine can't win this war and even if they could, pushing Ukrainians out of Ukraine is in fact genocide anyway. So people should moan. They should demand talks and they should demand an end of this conflict. Andthey should do this not because of their own wallets but because it is the only way to sustain peace for the people of Ukraine.

All very true Boycey but how do you suggest  Russia is brought to the table ?

[patman post]

Ukraine war: How has Russia's invasion changed Europe? | Euronews

As the war in Ukraine goes past its 6 month anniversary it seems most are paying through inflation and soaring prices

Will this lead to less support for Ukraine as countries turn their attention to fixing their own economies is anyones guess but outgoing PM Johnson has told us to basically stop moaning ,its only a few quid . Ukraine are paying in blood .

I guess support for Ukraine will diminish as people are adversely affected by, and get fed up with restrictions on their lives caused by sanctions on Russia and Russian retaliation.

The unknown factor is how effective Putin's supporters (plus influenced useful idiots, and those gamers who enjoy promoting Haw Haw-type views), are in influencing and nudging along the general mood. 

Already some Right-Wing politicians in Europe are clambering aboard the anti-sanction movement...

[B0ycey]

Ukraine war: How has Russia's invasion changed Europe? | Euronews

As the war in Ukraine goes past its 6 month anniversary it seems most are paying through inflation and soaring prices

Will this lead to less support for Ukraine as countries turn their attention to fixing their own economies is anyones guess but outgoing PM Johnson has told us to basically stop moaning ,its only a few quid . Ukraine are paying in blood .

A millionaire telling someone to stop moaning is someone who has had a silver spoon stuck in his ass his whole life and doesn't understand the wealth divide. Poverty has been a problem far longer than six months. And now the situation is going to be made a lot worse. Why should anyone stop moaning when they have been moaning for years? The truth is Ukraine has been in state of civil war since the Orange revolution. Where the war is today is in contested lands. If Zelensky thinks the war will end once the Russians pulls out means they are also defecto implying they are also going to push out Ukrainians out of their own land too. The Ukrainians right now are paying with blood but they do so because they believe LPR and DPR, who are Ukrainians, don't have any rights in terms of their language or political affiliation. Are you aware that Zelensky is criminalising opposition parties for supporting Russia despite many residents in the Donbass speaking Russian as their main language? The solution for the Donbass is autonomy. A split parliament very much like NI. And you can solve that by negotiation between Russia and Ukraine. Compromise is the only solution today not just for the cost of living crisis but also for sustaining peace in Ukraine. So BoJo, your wrong again. Ukraine can't win this war and even if they could, pushing Ukrainians out of Ukraine is in fact genocide anyway. So people should moan. They should demand talks and they should demand an end of this conflict. Andthey should do this not because of their own wallets but because it is the only way to sustain peace for the people of Ukraine.

[Streetwalker]

Ukraine war: How has Russia's invasion changed Europe? | Euronews

As the war in Ukraine goes past its 6 month anniversary it seems most are paying through inflation and soaring prices 

Will this lead to less support for Ukraine as countries turn their attention to fixing their own economies is anyones guess but outgoing PM Johnson has told us to basically stop moaning ,its only a few quid . Ukraine are paying in blood .