Stop panicking

[cromwell]

You know exactly who I mean Mr C. The ones with a couch in the front garden but no doubt have a brand new iPhone. In the old days it was called a fur coat and no knickers.

And you know exactly that the couch in the front garden are the minority.

[Nick]

The great unwashed eh Nick,anybody that doesnt vote Tory and are just ordinary people is that?

Anyway we now know what Truss is......if in doubt blame someone else.......in this case her chancellor the buck stops not with her then.

https://news.sky.com/story/liz-truss-sticks-by-plan-but-admits-mistakes-and-says-top-rate-tax-cut-was-chancellors-idea-12709993

You know exactly who I mean Mr C. The ones with a couch in the front garden but no doubt have a brand new iPhone. In the old days it was called a fur coat and no knickers. 

[Nick]

Nick is your television broken? Plus Barry had already mentioned the £8000. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-57764601

No one is disputing mortgages are going up, but £8K was just thrust into the mix as if it is a real figure. It wasn't me sir, Barry said it first... Pathetic!!

[cromwell]

Mortgages have been given out to people who could just about afford them for ever, a young couple just married don't consider if mortgage rates go up by 5%, they have the single goal of getting on the ladder. Financial institutions give out credit like it's going out of fashion, how else do the great unwashed get to be walking around with £1000 iPhones? The point being mortgages are given to people who cannot handle a moderate rate rise all the time.

The great unwashed eh Nick,anybody that doesnt vote Tory and are just ordinary people is that?

Anyway we now know what Truss is......if in doubt blame someone else.......in this case her chancellor the buck stops not with her then.

https://news.sky.com/story/liz-truss-sticks-by-plan-but-admits-mistakes-and-says-top-rate-tax-cut-was-chancellors-idea-12709993

[Nick]

What do you mean prove? You have to sit down with the bank and go through all your finances before a mortgage is approved. Perhaps mortgages pre 2008 were given out to anyone but not recently.

Mortgages have been given out to people who could just about afford them for ever, a young couple just married don't consider if mortgage rates go up by 5%, they have the single goal of getting on the ladder. Financial institutions give out credit like it's going out of fashion, how else do the great unwashed get to be walking around with £1000 iPhones? The point being mortgages are given to people who cannot handle a moderate rate rise all the time. 

[Sheepy]

I doubt that the Chinese stole that at all as they are the great innovators, yes we were once but it's really no use on blaming it all on the workers or unions.

Where do you see people like Fred the shred in all this,those who attempted to sell LV off not for the greater good but to line their pockets.

Then there's P&O ferries where the chief executive openly admitted he broke the law  and said he'd do it all over again.....action taken...... none.

In my working life I've seen some really excellent people at the helm,sadly though I've seen far too many who are interested in their status quo when they were at best mediocre but took far too much out and put very little in.

IMO it was madness to put all our eggs in one financial services basket where we keep getting burnt,on the old old forum I said we should encourage and build manufacturing sectors,I was laughed at for being behind the times,our future was London and finance,you'll get no innovation or invention there,well not of the type you envision.

What they do best is invent ways to lie,steal and cheat to amass fortunes and sod the country,there is a country and people outside of London which has been too long neglected.

Any failings of the NHS are not down to those at the coal face it's because they are asked to do too much and been hampered by political ideology through so many different administrations where the nhs should've been governed cross party instead of the trusts that few actually put any trust in at all and the pfi scandal to name but two.

I really do despair that the most vulnerable in our society are so often blamed for their own predicament or exploited and seen as an income stream rather than as people and here Imight add I've seen labour run authorities equally or more culpable of the above.
Regarding some of the above have been farmed out to the private sector which is why I say they are seen as an income stream rather than people.

Who in their right minds think it ok to house kids in care on caravan sites,in narrow boats or in one case a young individual who threatened suicide by jumping put in a flat high up above retail premises.
Then there's the mentally illor with learning disabilities held in places like that featured recently on  the beeb in my home city,the managers absent and the staff paid less than a shop worker left to their own devices and there's wonder why it all went wrong.

Its a mark of a country on how well they treat the most vulnerable and the Truss administration is threatening cuts in both services and benefits.

Regarding panic well there are many in the Tory party and not just at low level who are greatly perturbed about what's been done.

I don't decry Truss because she's a woman or Kwasi for being black,no it's because IMO they are inept,clueless and pushing policy on political doctrine and stubbornness by refusing to see they are mistaken........but it's the ordinary people and the vulnerable who will pay the greater price.

So basically, they all lied about what they were capable of and their own agendas, nothing new in that is there?

[cromwell]

Unless we are competitive there will be no wealth at all for anyone. Even the Labour tax to the hilt those who create wealth will simply send them abroad. It has happened before. Unless we make the NHS more appealing to doctors they will continue to vote with their feet. The policies of pumping ever more cash into failing institutions is stupid. Strikes for more money while denying that reform is necessary to keep up with innovations is stupid. Keeping the status quo to the point that good brains and ideas float off abroad is stupid. The EU is failing because it won't change and is protectionist. Thank goodness we have a chance to break free from that stultifying mindset.
How is it China can move badly parked cars with remote controlled wheeled frames that lift the cars and manoeuvre them out of the way? Where did they steal that idea from? Why are we so pedestrian in our thinking and planning? Where is the freedom for our inventors and innovators? I'll tell you - a workforce who want to go back to stream as long as it means they can maintain their old ways, and Union leaders who only see their own notoriety as the goal.

I didn't want more 'of the same' Sunak or 'wooden' Truss for PM but if this woman can take this country by the scruff of the neck and start talking forward thinking sense to it. All credit to her - for as long as the pedantic grey suits let her.

I doubt that the Chinese stole that at all as they are the great innovators, yes we were once but it's really no use on blaming it all on the workers or unions.

Where do you see people like Fred the shred in all this,those who attempted to sell LV off not for the greater good but to line their pockets.

Then there's P&O ferries where the chief executive openly admitted he broke the law  and said he'd do it all over again.....action taken...... none.

In my working life I've seen some really excellent people at the helm,sadly though I've seen far too many who are interested in their status quo when they were at best mediocre but took far too much out and put very little in.

IMO it was madness to put all our eggs in one financial services basket where we keep getting burnt,on the old old forum I said we should encourage and build manufacturing sectors,I was laughed at for being behind the times,our future was London and finance,you'll get no innovation or invention there,well not of the type you envision.

What they do best is invent ways to lie,steal and cheat to amass fortunes and sod the country,there is a country and people outside of London which has been too long neglected.

Any failings of the NHS are not down to those at the coal face it's because they are asked to do too much and been hampered by political ideology through so many different administrations where the nhs should've been governed cross party instead of the trusts that few actually put any trust in at all and the pfi scandal to name but two.

I really do despair that the most vulnerable in our society are so often blamed for their own predicament or exploited and seen as an income stream rather than as people and here Imight add I've seen labour run authorities equally or more culpable of the above.
Regarding some of the above have been farmed out to the private sector which is why I say they are seen as an income stream rather than people.

Who in their right minds think it ok to house kids in care on caravan sites,in narrow boats or in one case a young individual who threatened suicide by jumping put in a flat high up above retail premises.
Then there's the mentally illor with learning disabilities held in places like that featured recently on  the beeb in my home city,the managers absent and the staff paid less than a shop worker left to their own devices and there's wonder why it all went wrong.

Its a mark of a country on how well they treat the most vulnerable and the Truss administration is threatening cuts in both services and benefits.

Regarding panic well there are many in the Tory party and not just at low level who are greatly perturbed about what's been done.

I don't decry Truss because she's a woman or Kwasi for being black,no it's because IMO they are inept,clueless and pushing policy on political doctrine and stubbornness by refusing to see they are mistaken........but it's the ordinary people and the vulnerable who will pay the greater price.

[B0ycey]

Complete conjecture and something you can never prove. Try sticking within the realms of possibility.

What do you mean prove? You have to sit down with the bank and go through all your finances before a mortgage is approved. Perhaps mortgages pre 2008 were given out to anyone but not recently.

[papasmurf]

So now you're giving exact figures that someone will be paying extra based on absolutely no data. Utter nonsense.

Nick is your television broken? Plus Barry had already mentioned the £8000. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-57764601

[Nick]

Good points? Try telling that to someone whose fixed term mortgage rate is near ended and will be replaced with new rate that will cost them an extra £8000 a year. (That is not even a maximum.)

So now you're giving exact figures that someone will be paying extra based on absolutely no data. Utter nonsense. 

[Nick]

[highlight]I think you'll find that EVERYONE who has a mortgage did sit down and worked out they could afford it[/highlight]. Besides, Jesus was the biggest Communist that every graced this world. The guy didn't charge for Bread and Fish and gave Ceaser his crappy coins back.

Complete conjecture and something you can never prove. Try sticking within the realms of possibility. 

[patman post]

They did not allow for increases in interest rates. And, they are nowhere near 15% which I had to put up with. (And could just afford).
Surely people with £400k mortgages, which will pay an extra £8k a year are the richer people in society, but you lefties would deny giving them back 5% of their own money.

Wasn't the UK told Labour had got rid of boom and bust after that? So when lower single figure interest rates for mortgages seemed the norm over time, I guess even factoring two or three percent rate rises seemed excessive.

That lower interest rate and the shortage of supply has driven up house prices — currently averaging around £300k country wide and way over half a million in London. Now, every 1% rise is scary.

Does the country deserve the treatment it's getting from its government? It did vote for it, and it did vote for Brexit, so maybe the British are now into self-harming, like medieval mortificationists...

[Sheepy]

The Earth is ours and so are the things that come from it Patman. Private property in human existence terms is a new concept and I don't care what Barry posts, Jesus wouldn't want anyone homeless because they couldn't afford to live. His quote was more on over a indulgence and greed rather than punishing risk if you read the passage.

Well, it all gave me a laugh, now the Tories are telling you just what you were telling us, don't panic and vote Westminster party, they know best.

[Good old]

I follow American politics very well Barry, and it is down to unregulated practices for why they have high repayments. It is because mortgages are given to people who can't afford them and the high interest rate is due to the risk of the loan. The Yanks just sell these toxic assets to the rest of the world anyway. I won't blame the Tories for the Yanks crashing their housing market, but I will blame them for crashing ours.

And almost our economy.Not suitable for home politics but true.

[Good old]

When mortgage interest rates of 15%-17% were around, three bedroom terrace houses in London were on the market for £50K-£60K. They now go for £1m up. I bet plenty of areas in the rest of the country experienced similar percentage rises.

Since Kwarteng's Truss budget, many mortgage products have been withdrawn from the market and are not available at any price. Lenders don't want to saddle themselves with mortgages that borrowers can't repay, and can only be recouped by selling property into a market in which few people can then afford to buy...

Not only did other areas experience those rises but they also suffered the experience of multiple repossessions.
With the repossessed properties auctioned off to property speculators, for peanuts, £35,000 houses for as little as £6/7 thousand at times in the West Country .only to reappear on the market a year or two later at prices above even there original real cost , the great Tory ethic in full swing.
This is going to happen again, and the question has to be, what is so wonderful so ethically acceptable about a system of housing that can fail so easily putting any number of people on the street,  with all the costs involved in just sheltering them, when the only plus is a quick killing for Vutures/speculators? Somewhere to invest the 5%tax saving maybe.
It pleases me mortgage companies are being frugal, but  it doesn't help those with mortgages, they are snared, they either afford any new deal or go under. The real problem is the housing market, it's over heated , as against the actual homes, and not any longer fit for a Generally low pay society. And low pay is as much a part of this problem, as interest rates that don't match the ability to pay. It's obvious all to often mortgages are granted with no significant room for an increase in interest rates. If it's wrong to take such a mortgage it should be wrong to offer  it.
But not in the Tory world apparently, and that's not aimed at you Patman, just an aside.