NI protocol

[Nick]

You're wrong — the (various) government administrations, haven't delivered what was promised by the different anti-EU factions,  notably border control and reduced immigration, cheaper food, and many substantial (oven-ready) trading agreements.

What has been delivered is a critically depleted NHS, labour shortages despite record immigration, food shortages and imposed rationing, and soaring inflation.

Whatever spin is put on what's happened, people are suffering, and they're likely to show their displeasure at the polls...

The issues we are seeing are being repeated all around the world, nothing to do with Brexit, it's the lag from Covid. 

https://epthinktank.eu/2023/03/02/food-security-in-2023-eu-response-to-an-evolving-crisis/

https://www.kornferry.com/insights/this-week-in-leadership/talent-crunch-future-of-work

[patman post]

The government hasn't enacted what we asked for, they've done a half arsed version. And the blame is squarely at the door of May-be.

You're wrong — the (various) government administrations, haven't delivered what was promised by the different anti-EU factions,  notably border control and reduced immigration, cheaper food, and many substantial (oven-ready) trading agreements.

What has been delivered is a critically depleted NHS, labour shortages despite record immigration, food shortages and imposed rationing, and soaring inflation.

Whatever spin is put on what's happened, people are suffering, and they're likely to show their displeasure at the polls...

[patman post]

Yep . Barnier saw the UK government  wasn't actually that keen on leaving anyway  and would have agreed to anything they thought they could get through parliament .
As we know May overplayed that hand leaving Johnson to sort it out which even if the intent was there it was problamatic given the 'deal' Mayhem had created with her European counterparts .

Sunak has kicked the can down the road once more while declaring its the best deal in the World . Trouble is when you open the can its got Barniers and Mays fingerprints all over it .

Yep — Rishi Sunak let the cat out of the bag when he pointed out that Northern Ireland would have the best deal in the world (ie, customs free access to the fifth biggest market in the world and the EU). 

Isn't this something the whole of the UK had before Brexit...?

[Unlucky4Sum]

The worrying differences between Downing Street claims and the EU asserts, reports ANDREW PIERCE | Daily Mail Online

A day late but at least someone has read the proposals and whats more what is actually in it and what Sunak said dont concur .
Im sure everyone wants the N Ireland issue sorted so we can move on and return to discussing fishing quotas but all the government and the EU keep doing is feeding us the same tripe they have been doing since the Mayhem WA was dissmissed as brino .
And we diddn't like it, we didnt like Johnsons version ,but went with it for the sake of kicking the can into next year  and we dont like Sunaks .
When all parties agree that leaving part of the UK inside the EU is not wanted nor needed they may have a basis for negociation .
If they can have green lanes /red lanes number plate technology  trusted traders and some customs checks in the Irish sea they can have them on the internal Irish border .

Interesting thanks.  I don't like the Mail's Pierce but he's no liar

And there's certainly differences between the UK and EU accounts of that agreement which is not good at all.

UK: https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/1138989/The_Windsor_Framework_a_new_way_forward.pdf

EU:  https://ec.europa.eu/commission/presscorner/detail/en/qanda_23_1271

[johnofgwent]

It took me about thirty minutes to read through the document at about one o clock yesterday after someone elsewhere was kind enough to post a link to the government website hosting it

After five minutes it became obvious to me all shifting this declaration to a UK location has done is pretended we have control. A bit like as soon as initial drilling exploits found oil in the Irish Sea the admiralty maps where the area was called St George's Channel started getting extra prominence

The Windsor Knot makes far too much use if the phrase 'for goods a business can demonstrate will remain in Northern Ireland'

How the holy F@@@ are they going to be able to do that given decades of competent criss border smuggling of guns, bombs and the materials to make them and criminals competent to make them without blowing themselves to shit.

Fact is this waste of space declaration merely swaps one set of impossible bits of paperwork with another. And its the business who will be carrying the can. And all that bloidybwoman has said is to promise to talk a lot

[Streetwalker]

So apart from you what recognised political observer is portraying it this way.  

We will see after they have read whats actually proposed and the excitment has died down .

The worrying differences between Downing Street claims and the EU asserts, reports ANDREW PIERCE | Daily Mail Online

A day late but at least someone has read the proposals and whats more what is actually in it and what Sunak said dont concur . 
Im sure everyone wants the N Ireland issue sorted so we can move on and return to discussing fishing quotas  but all the government and the EU keep doing is feeding us the same tripe they have been doing since the Mayhem WA was dissmissed as brino .
And we diddn't like it, we didnt like Johnsons version ,but went with it for the sake of kicking the can into next year   and we dont like Sunaks .
When all parties agree that leaving part of the UK inside the EU is not wanted nor needed they may have a basis for negociation .
 If they can have green lanes /red lanes number plate technology  trusted traders and some customs checks in the Irish sea they can have them on the internal Irish border .

[Streetwalker]

The government hasn't enacted what we asked for, they've done a half arsed version. And the blame is squarely at the door of May-be.

Yep . Barnier saw the UK government  wasn't actually that keen on leaving anyway  and would have agreed to anything they thought they could get through parliament . 
As we know May overplayed that hand leaving Johnson to sort it out which even if the intent was there it was problamatic given the 'deal' Mayhem had created with her European counterparts . 

Sunak has kicked the can down the road once more while declaring its the best deal in the World . Trouble is when you open the can its got Barniers and Mays fingerprints all over it .

[Nick]

Perhaps the "the political union and creeping fedralism" didn't impact people as you say, and didn't actually cause the problems you cite. And "mass immigration" doesn't appear to have stopped, and the shortage of supposed "low paid labour" hasn't forced pay up enough to encourage local labour to take its place.

Many jobs in agriculture and hospitality haven't been taken up by locals now EU workers have left. But home renovation and extension are continuing at a rapid pace round here and meanwhile house prices are falling — so it seems unlikely cheap labour was causing the difficulties you imagine.

However, it now seems that Northern Irish residents can now enjoy the benefits of being EU citizens and export and trade and work both in the EU and the in the UK — all benefits mainland the British enjoyed until recently.

As I said, great for Northern Ireland, but it looks like the mainland is going to continue struggling...

The government hasn't enacted what we asked for, they've done a half arsed version. And the blame is squarely at the door of May-be. 

[Streetwalker]

Perhaps the "the political union and creeping fedralism" didn't impact people as you say, and didn't actually cause the problems you cite. And "mass immigration" doesn't appear to have stopped, and the shortage of supposed "low paid labour" hasn't forced pay up enough to encourage local labour to take its place.

Maybe pay needs to go up a bit more to encourage local labour to join in ,its been too low at the low end for too long . As you say though immigration is still high which either means they are taking the better paid proffesional jobs or are here for a free ride . I would say its the former .

Many jobs in agriculture and hospitality haven't been taken up by locals now EU workers have left. But home renovation and extension are continuing at a rapid pace round here and meanwhile house prices are falling — so it seems unlikely cheap labour was causing the difficulties you imagine.

Home renovations have always been a different market to major constuction jobs that saw wage stagnation during freedom of movement . More flexable planning laws have given people the freedom to improve and extend their own homes rather than go through the cost of moving which has kept that market vibrant and maybe taken the heat out of house prices 

However, it now seems that Northern Irish residents can now enjoy the benefits of being EU citizens and export and trade and work both in the EU and the in the UK — all benefits mainland the British enjoyed until recently.

As I said, great for Northern Ireland, but it looks like the mainland is going to continue struggling...

And they will still be under EU laws , Maybe being Irish that doesn't mean as much to them as it does to us but I cant see the DUP going for it  which will leave Rishi to have another go at it . 

As for struggling , our trade with the rest of the world is growing as our exporters are finding new markets . Of course its still important that the same goes for the EU but they are no longer the be all and end all . 

[patman post]

It did , it was the political union and creeping fedralism that was the problem, not to mention mass immigration of a low paid labour force that led to the suppression of wages for many ,lower working conditions and the collapes of training schemes as businesses took advantage of the new pre trained workforce .

The remain camp latched on early to the benefits of trade as they had little else to promote their argument , if that was all it was about , a common market , we would never have heard of UKIP let alone a referendum

Perhaps the "the political union and creeping fedralism" didn't impact people as you say, and didn't actually cause the problems you cite. And "mass immigration" doesn't appear to have stopped, and the shortage of supposed "low paid labour" hasn't forced pay up enough to encourage local labour to take its place.

Many jobs in agriculture and hospitality haven't been taken up by locals now EU workers have left. But home renovation and extension are continuing at a rapid pace round here and meanwhile house prices are falling — so it seems unlikely cheap labour was causing the difficulties you imagine.

However, it now seems that Northern Irish residents can now enjoy the benefits of being EU citizens and export and trade and work both in the EU and the in the UK — all benefits mainland the British enjoyed until recently.

As I said, great for Northern Ireland, but it looks like the mainland is going to continue struggling...

[Streetwalker]

Brexit: Rishi Sunak says Northern Ireland in 'unbelievably special position' because of access to EU single market

The prime minister said his new Brexit deal puts Northern Ireland in an "unbelievably special position" because it gives it access to both the UK and European Union markets - creating "the world's most exciting economic zone".
https://news.sky.com/story/brexit-rishi-sunak-says-northern-ireland-in-unbelievably-special-position-because-of-access-to-eu-single-market-12821991

Bully for Northern Ireland. But didn't the whole of the UK enjoy this "unbelievably special position" before it left the EU...?

It did , it was the political union and creeping fedralism that was the problem, not to mention mass immigration of a low paid labour force that led to the suppression of wages for many ,lower working conditions and the collapes of training schemes as businesses took advantage of the new pre trained workforce .

The remain camp latched on early to the benefits of trade as they had little else to promote their argument , if that was all it was about , a common market , we would never have heard of UKIP let alone a referendum 

[patman post]

Brexit: Rishi Sunak says Northern Ireland in 'unbelievably special position' because of access to EU single market

The prime minister said his new Brexit deal puts Northern Ireland in an "unbelievably special position" because it gives it access to both the UK and European Union markets - creating "the world's most exciting economic zone".
https://news.sky.com/story/brexit-rishi-sunak-says-northern-ireland-in-unbelievably-special-position-because-of-access-to-eu-single-market-12821991

Bully for Northern Ireland. But didn't the whole of the UK enjoy this "unbelievably special position" before it left the EU...?

[Streetwalker]

So apart from you what recognised political observer is portraying it this way.  Well apart from Boris and Mad Nad that is

We will see after they have read whats actually proposed and the excitment has died down .

Sunak was running around yesterday saying being in the single market was brilliant , that being in the single market and the UK market was the best deal in the world .
Seeing as that is what he voted against in 2016 is a suprise the remainers haven't picked up on it 

[Unlucky4Sum]

Well now the excitment of Rishi's presentation and the apparent Royal approval there seems to be a problem with the all new protocol .

Its basicslly the same as the old one

EU law still applies in a part of the United Kingdom , VAT rates still set by the EU  ,ECJ still rules in NIreland while  the whole of the UK to remain under the supremacy of the ECHR

Yes there are a few bits with regard customs checks and technology being used that was always dissregarded as impossible  that are an improvment on the last draft but the main concerns were always with regard to sovereinty . And that hasn't changed .


An unelected globalist prime minister ,  jumping around like a teenager with his new best mate Von der Leyen telling us they have fixed everything Boris had broken while smiling like Cheshire cats . Its only a tidying up excercise so wont need a vote in Parliament ,  we are getting more like the EU every day.

Never trust a Tory .

So apart from you what recognised political observer is portraying it this way.  Well apart from Boris and Mad Nad that is

[Streetwalker]

Never trust any politician.

Still, it would be nice to have a Tory government

It would , unfortunately there are not enough of them and on the odd occasion they do come to the fore they are (sometimes quickly) dispatched from within .