Should people be sacked for making factually accurate statements?

Started by papasmurf, March 10, 2023, 05:31:55 PM

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Unlucky4Sum

Quote from: johnofgwent on March 12, 2023, 09:15:49 PM
Well, making excuses in Ealing for extending his fucking ULEZ he is quoted as saying

Let's be frank, let's call a spade a spade. Some of those outside are part of the far-right. Some are Covid deniers. Some are vaccine-deniers. And some are Toriest
So you can't back Streetwalker's dumb comment then.  

You should have checked what it actually was

PS: They will get nowhere at all calling concerned citizens far right racists.
Streetwalker:  I dunno , Sadiq Khan seems to get away with it 

Now run along and see if you can find Khan calling concerned citizns 'far right racists'   You've failed spectacularly so with that post ^

johnofgwent

<t>In matters of taxation, Lord Clyde\'s summing up in the 1929 case Inland Revenue v Ayrshire Pullman Services is worth a glance.</t>

johnofgwent

Quote from: Unlucky4Sum on March 12, 2023, 08:38:34 PM
And you can back that with evidence?  Please do so if true
Well, making excuses in Ealing for extending his fucking ULEZ he is quoted as saying 

Let's be frank, let's call a spade a spade. Some of those outside are part of the far-right. Some are Covid deniers. Some are vaccine-deniers. And some are Toriest
<t>In matters of taxation, Lord Clyde\'s summing up in the 1929 case Inland Revenue v Ayrshire Pullman Services is worth a glance.</t>

Unlucky4Sum

Quote from: Streetwalker on March 12, 2023, 04:01:37 PM
I dunno , Sadiq Khan seems to get away with it
And you can back that with evidence?  Please do so if true

Good old

Quote from: Streetwalker on March 12, 2023, 07:15:53 PM
Dont think he has hit a nerve ,what he has done is use language that is unacceptable . If your going to call out people as akin to the  1930's German government then I think you need a bit more to back you up than opinion (like evidence) especially when your working for the national broadcaster .

Maybe when he has had a think about it or someone has educated him he will realise Braverman and the Tories are not left wing racists , he will appologise get back to work and wind his neck in .

The real question has nothing to do with whether  he was right to compare to 1930s Germany. Strictly speaking he wasn't as it gave to much room for its limited content to be inflated beyond what it was he actually intended. But as with all of us he has the right to make such a statement even when badly made.
Oh, of course it's the BBC they are really after, what's new? With a staunch Tory donor to lead it, how could it ever suffer bias?
One wonders what the government will say ,or more to the point do, if Lineker, leaves the BBC to earn three times as much else where and continues to be critical .
Lineker, did not have to be right about the language used,  as the reaction to his comment ,calling for his head basically or at the very least a sniffling apology , whilst doing as much possible to belittle the man personally, calling into question , not just his right to criticise, but his ability to have an opinion is exactly in line with the actions of 1930s Germany. And indeed any other government that will not tolerate criticism or dissent. 
As for education ,what would you suggest ? The Chinese might help in that respect.

papasmurf

Quote from: Streetwalker on March 12, 2023, 07:15:53 PM
 If your going to call out people as akin to the  1930's German government then I think you need a bit more to back you up than opinion (like evidence) especially when your working for the national broadcaster .

There is a mass of evidence, all of the 1930s propaganda, speeches and articles have been translated and film from the time subtitled. Why the Conservative party has been using those in part or sometimes whole passages is something that they need to answer. They have been using them since at least Peter Lilley was an Minister for the currently named DWP.
Braverman is the latest Tory to use what are frankly very close to direct quotes. The quotes have been used to scapegoat and demonise specific groups of people for several decades.
Nemini parco qui vivit in orbe

Streetwalker

Quote from: Good old on March 12, 2023, 05:12:17 PM
And in the thirties the first thing the German government did to some one with a profile that dared to not agree with what they said or did, was to take that profile away, subject them to some form of ridicule. Ironic or what?
I don't actually like the man , I think he is over rated, but  his political comments don't have to be totally accurate any more than anyone else's.
He has obviously hit a nerve that's for sure, because if this bunch of non performing clowns that like to think they shouldn't be questioned or critiqued , think suppressing free speech is the way forward for British democracy, which calling for a man's sacking , on the basis of a criticism is a prime example, then it only becomes another good reason for the electorate to get them out next year.
Dont think he has hit a nerve ,what he has done is use language that is unacceptable . If your going to call out people as akin to the  1930's German government then I think you need a bit more to back you up than opinion (like evidence) especially when your working for the national broadcaster . 

Maybe when he has had a think about it or someone has educated him he will realise Braverman and the Tories are not left wing racists , he will appologise get back to work and wind his neck in .

papasmurf

Quote from: Good old on March 12, 2023, 05:12:17 PM
And in the thirties the first thing the German government did to some one with a profile that dared to not agree with what they said or did, was to take that profile away, subject them to some form of ridicule. 
Where I live the Tories have heaped abuse on concerned citizens calling them far right wing racists. (Not exactly a vote winner.)
Nemini parco qui vivit in orbe

Good old

Quote from: papasmurf on March 11, 2023, 10:18:38 AM
As anyone who has studied Germany in the lead up to the second World War Lineker's comments about the language use about illegal immigrants by the Conservatives is similar to that used in 1930s Germany is factually accurate.

And in the thirties the first thing the German government did to some one with a profile that dared to not agree with what they said or did, was to take that profile away, subject them to some form of ridicule. Ironic or what?
I don't actually like the man , I think he is over rated, but  his political comments don't have to be totally accurate any more than anyone else's. 
He has obviously hit a nerve that's for sure, because if this bunch of non performing clowns that like to think they shouldn't be questioned or critiqued , think suppressing free speech is the way forward for British democracy, which calling for a man's sacking , on the basis of a criticism is a prime example, then it only becomes another good reason for the electorate to get them out next year.

Streetwalker

Quote from: papasmurf on March 12, 2023, 03:50:18 PM
They will get nowhere at all calling concerned citizens far right racists.
I dunno , Sadiq Khan seems to get away with it 

papasmurf

Quote from: patman post on March 12, 2023, 03:30:44 PM
There's every indication that many Tory MPs will be looking for other jobs after the next election because, even if the Tories manage to retain power, they're unlikely to maintain an 80-seat majority...
They will get nowhere at all calling concerned citizens far right racists.
Nemini parco qui vivit in orbe

patman post

Quote from: papasmurf on March 12, 2023, 03:12:06 PM
You imagine wrong, totally wrong. I suspect my (Tory) MP now realises he will be looking for another job after the next general election.
There's every indication that many Tory MPs will be looking for other jobs after the next election because, even if the Tories manage to retain power, they're unlikely to maintain an 80-seat majority...
On climate change — we're talking, we're beginning to act, but we're still not doing enough...

papasmurf

Quote from: patman post on March 12, 2023, 02:11:30 PM
I can imagine your Tory MP's emails:
You imagine wrong, totally wrong. I suspect my (Tory) MP now realises he will be looking for another job after the next general election.
Nemini parco qui vivit in orbe

patman post

Quote from: papasmurf on March 12, 2023, 12:55:22 PM
Borchester stop telling lies about me. Lineker is right about the language use.  You do not live in Cornwall. Cornwall is now an ever worsening disaster and the bulk of the problems are down to or being made worse by the Tories.
Even my (Tory,) MP has emailed me twice recently to apologise.
I can imagine your Tory MP's emails:

I'm sorry, I don't understand your complaint, etc

and

I'm very sorry, I still don't understand what you are complaining about, etc...

On climate change — we're talking, we're beginning to act, but we're still not doing enough...

papasmurf

Quote from: Borchester on March 12, 2023, 12:41:06 PM

Self respect sets you free.


If you spend your life blaming everything on the Tories or telling childish lies about the  area in which you live then you will never be free
Borchester stop telling lies about me. Lineker is right about the language use.  You do not live in Cornwall. Cornwall is now an ever worsening disaster and the bulk of the problems are down to or being made worse by the Tories.
Even my (Tory,) MP has emailed me twice recently to apologise.
Nemini parco qui vivit in orbe