More Boris lockdown breaches

[BeElBeeBub]

Seeing as deaths per 1000 people went down we have to conclude the population increased.

Yes, population has increased so the absolute numbers are not directly comparable. But the spikes are 

As your graph shows the trend of deaths per capita has been trending for decades.

Right up until 2020 when it went up.

2021 10
2020 10.3
2019  9.1
2018  9.3
2017  9.2
2016  9.1
2015  9.3
2014  8.8
2013  9
2012  8.9
2011  8.7
2010  8.9

[Nick]

Deaths registered England and Wales for calender years

2022 576k
2021 585k
2020 607k
2019 529k
2018 540k
2017 532k
2016 523k
2015 528k
2014 500k

As you can see 2020 and 2021 were well above the run of the last few years.

In addition the highest monthly deaths in that period were April 2020 (88k) and Jan 2021 (73k)

So the question is, if COVID wasn't killing people, what was?

Seeing as deaths per 1000 people went down we have to conclude the population increased. 

[BeElBeeBub]

Are you suggesting lockdown, fear-porn all over the media, removing elderly from hospitals are putting them in care homes, wearing masks which restrict oxygen, were unidentified?  Or just a coincidence that it happened before deaths went up (a bit).  The problem with your assumptions is that if the flu is going round, and you do all these things, more people will die.

"On 17 March, NHS England and NHS Improvement wrote to trusts telling them to "expand critical care capacity to the maximum" by freeing up beds."

https://fullfact.org/health/coronavirus-care-homes-discharge/

I'm suggesting all those things were identified by idiots.

By your logic seatbelts cause all traffic deaths.

Masks restricted oxygen? Do you listen to yourself? Very possibly, someone with a severe lung complication might have a problem with a mask. The overwhelming majority of the population can wear a mask with zeromeffect on their oxygen saturation.  The people who make masks are idiots. Allowing the user to breathe is fairly high up their priority list. People wear masks with far higher filtration ratings literally all day whilst doing manual labour and have no ill effects 

If wearing a surgicalasl gives you breathing problems I'd suggest you see a doctor immediately as you have some serious health issues.

Deaths going up "a bit" - they nearly doubled. For April 2020.

[BeElBeeBub]

God knows which Covid deniers you are referring to.  I certainly never said "probably the vaccine".  Now you are trying to score points, disingenuously, and inappropriately.  Are you denying that vaccines were known to lower the immune system?

Yes I am denying thqt vaccines lower the immune system.

That's not how vaccines or the immune system work.

It's also not how cancer works.

[BeElBeeBub]

I didn't say anybody.  I said based on positive tests.  The rigidity of rules is irrelevant.  Rules change.  You provided no evidence it was a rumour.

That's not how rumours work. I don't have to disprove a crackpot rumour. You have to prove that doctors were systematically putting covid down as cause of death for deaths that weren't caused by COVID (eg bus)

Given the 100's of thousands of excess deaths that occured worldwide in 2020 and 2021, you've have to have an awful lot.of doctors, in an awful lot of countries, all merrily putting down covid on the death certificates of house fire victims, car crash victims, people who chokednon a grape over a.2 year period

.
And even then, after conjuring some international conspiracy involving thousands of doctors across the globe, you'd still have to explain what *did* cause those extra deaths.

[Scott777]

Also Covid Deniers: "your sister died of cancer? It was probably the vaccine"

God knows which Covid deniers you are referring to.  I certainly never said "probably the vaccine".  Now you are trying to score points, disingenuously, and inappropriately.  Are you denying that vaccines were known to lower the immune system?

[Scott777]

*Something* must have casued those deaths.

Are they proposing that there was some other, unidentified, cause and Covid was just a coincidence?

Are you suggesting lockdown, fear-porn all over the media, removing elderly from hospitals are putting them in care homes, wearing masks which restrict oxygen, were unidentified?  Or just a coincidence that it happened before deaths went up (a bit).  The problem with your assumptions is that if the flu is going round, and you do all these things, more people will die.

"On 17 March, NHS England and NHS Improvement wrote to trusts telling them to "expand critical care capacity to the maximum" by freeing up beds."

https://fullfact.org/health/coronavirus-care-homes-discharge/

[BeElBeeBub]

Sorry to hear the news.  I have to ask, was she vaccinated?  Cancer relies on a working immune system, which was shown to be damaged by the injectable junk they call the Covid vaccine.

Seriously?
Covid deniers: "doctors were blaming covid for deaths of people who died after being hitnbyna bus"
Also Covid Deniers: "your sister died of cancer? It was probably the vaccine"

[Scott777]

Contrary to rumour, doctors weren't writing covid for anybody.  The death certificate has fairly rigid rules on how to classify deaths

I didn't say anybody.  I said based on positive tests.  The rigidity of rules is irrelevant.  Rules change.  You provided no evidence it was a rumour.

[BeElBeeBub]

There's also the point that because of the lockdown, spacing out, mask wearing, handwashing, etc, cases of flu and other ailments that can hit the elderly and vulnerable hard, were lessened...

Very much so, but the dedicated "it's just the flu" denier will wave that away.

The raw death numbers are hard to dismiss.

How do they explain a large rise in deaths during 2020 and 2021 and, in particular  the twoonths highlighted?

*Something* must have casued those deaths.

Are they proposing that there was some other, unidentified, cause and Covid was just a coincidence?

[Scott777]

My sister died of a brain tumour 2 years ago, 

Sorry to hear the news.  I have to ask, was she vaccinated?  Cancer relies on a working immune system, which was shown to be damaged by the injectable junk they call the Covid vaccine.

[patman post]

Deaths registered England and Wales for calender years

2022 576k
2021 585k
2020 607k
2019 529k
2018 540k
2017 532k
2016 523k
2015 528k
2014 500k

As you can see 2020 and 2021 were well above the run of the last few years.

In addition the highest monthly deaths in that period were April 2020 (88k) and Jan 2021 (73k)

So the question is, if COVID wasn't killing people, what was?

There's also the point that because of the lockdown, spacing out, mask wearing, handwashing, etc, cases of flu and other ailments that can hit the elderly and vulnerable hard, were lessened...

[BeElBeeBub]

Yes, doctors were writing Covid on death certificates for anyone who had received a positive test within a certain period.  Covid was a notifiable disease, and maybe that was the legal reason.  This is true, even though the official narrative said you could have Covid without any symptoms, and therefore not be sick.

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/coronavirus-covid-19-listed-as-a-notifiable-disease

No they weren't.

There was confusion as the daily figures that Matt Hancock readnout every night were compiled by comapinrng death certs with positive covid tests in the last 28 days.

This meant the hypothetical asymptomatic person hit by a bus would be counted.
But it also meant that the person who died after 30 days on a ventilator wasn't.

This measure was used because it was fast.

The better measure that only became available a week or so after death was to look at cause on death certificate.

Contrary to rumour, doctors weren't writing covid for anybody.  The death certificate has fairly rigid rules on how to classify deaths

As a side note, the death certificate figures tended to be larger than the initial estimates from deaths within 28.days.

[BeElBeeBub]

Look at U.K. deaths for the last 10 years and show me a spike during Covid.

Deaths registered England and Wales for calender years

2022 576k
2021 585k
2020 607k
2019 529k
2018 540k
2017 532k
2016 523k
2015 528k
2014 500k

As you can see 2020 and 2021 were well above the run of the last few years.

In addition the highest monthly deaths in that period were April 2020 (88k) and Jan 2021 (73k)

So the question is, if COVID wasn't killing people, what was?

[Scott777]

My uncle died coughing his lungs out with Covid before he could be tested so isn't listed as a Covid death.  Some took over 4 weeks to die so aren't either. These all make for trivial levels of error. 

There's nothing trivial about thousands of elderly people who were required to get tested for Covid (but not the flu) who maybe died because of flu, but tests that don't work said they had Covid.  If you keep testing people, with a test that is unreliable, eventually it will be positive.