Gaza

[morayloon]

In the eyes of Hamas?  Well if anyone was still on the fence that should convince them to start doing the
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=toDA6rZdPfA

Well, Hamas carried out the attack. Aren't they allowed to give their side of the story, their reasons for carrying it out? Or is Free Speech only for one side?

[Streetwalker]

I find it difficult to understand how a religion, whose people have suffered so much over the centuries, and especially during WWII, can support the genocide of the Palestinian people. The war did not begin on 7th October!

It  started before Moses went up the mountain  and trying to understand it has been a problem for most people ever since .

[morayloon]

You mean the BBC VERIFY jury? What a joke.

From someone who thinks GB News is impartial that is rich. The BBC reported the Israeli denial and reported the US and the UKs support for the Israelis in trying to debunk the Hamas accusations.
But, I will repeat, that is what they would be expected to come out with. Most of the objective, neutral countries have yet to decide who carried out the atrocity. Their hesitation? the dodgy dossier

[Streetwalker]

There you go, misrepresenting my views again. I have never said that I believe any claim that there was no massacre.
The guy said that they don't regard the illegal, armed, Israeli settlers as 'civilians'. The question follows, how many of the Festival attendees were settlers and thus, in the eyes of Hamas, were legitimate targets?
https://news.sky.com/video/hamas-official-tells-sky-news-the-group-hasnt-killed-any-civilians-in-israel-12981264

In the eyes of Hamas?  Well if anyone was still on the fence that should convince them to start doing the 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=toDA6rZdPfA

[morayloon]

The evidence is that Israel were in peace talks with the Saudi when Hamas struck , the Hospital got bombed when Biden was on route to talk of restraint to Israel and peace with Arab nations .

Who does that benefit ?
ans, the religion of death

I find it difficult to understand how a religion, whose people have suffered so much over the centuries, and especially during WWII, can support the genocide of the Palestinian people. The war did not begin on 7th October!

[morayloon]

You're wasting your time. Moray's colours are firmly fixed to the Pallywood mast. He won't believe Hamas lie, even though Hamas said they killed no civilians on 7th October. How difficult is to spot the lies?

There you go, misrepresenting my views again. I have never said that I believe any claim that there was no massacre.
The guy said that they don't regard the illegal, armed, Israeli settlers as 'civilians'. The question follows, how many of the Festival attendees were settlers and thus, in the eyes of Hamas, were legitimate targets?
https://news.sky.com/video/hamas-official-tells-sky-news-the-group-hasnt-killed-any-civilians-in-israel-12981264

[morayloon]

The Israelis admit their mistakes. They did not fire on the hospital.

They say!!!

[morayloon]

Can I ask where you are getting your figures for civilian deaths in Gaza?
How many does your source say have died?

I believe that 1400+ Israelis were killed by Hamas.
About 2,000 Hamas terrorists were killed in Israel as the IDF wiped them out.
I don't have many figures for Hamas or civilian deaths in Gaza. I do hope you are not relying on the "Gazan health ministry", because it is Hamas.

The Palestinian deaths are suspect because you have little faith in Hamas. I would counter that by saying that Israeli propaganda can be just as suspect.

[morayloon]

Face it, we (us here), don't know.

Like you, I may have my suspicions. But whichever force is to blame, I will continue to feel sad for all the loss of life and antagonistic towards those making political capital out of it...

That is the whole point, we don't know! But, to rely on what the Israelis say, backed up by the unqualified support from the West, their denial should be treated with caution. Given their past record of bombing schools and hospitals, that the Baptist hospital strike was caused by a missile fired by the IDF is the more likely situation.
Just heard Cleverly parroting Sunak's claim it was a misfired Hamas rocket. Well, he would say that wouldn't he. Dodgy dossier springs to mind!!!

[Barry]

In matters such as this I tend to go for a variety of sources. This includes the BBC, Al Jazeera, Sky News, LBC radio, Channel 4 News, and reputable magazines like the New Statesman. I will also read online anything posted by the more reputable elements of our newsprint media, if it is not behind a paywall. And by that I essentially mean the broadsheets regardless of their political leanings. Also the I newspaper. I avoid unreliable news outlets altogether, including the Mail, the Express, the Sun, the Mirror, and the Star and avoid broadcast media with an obvious domestic political agenda like GB News who seem more interested in selling opinions to us than reporting news.

I do not get my information from Hamas.com,

But you do. Because these free publications just regurgitate the Hamas figures.
How many civilians have died in this current round in Gaza, Steve?
Please cite sources.

[Barry]

There are always mistakes that no country will admit to unless they have to. Israel is no different.

I will prefer to go wherever the evidence leads me but the jury is still out right now.

You mean the BBC VERIFY jury? What a joke.

[Streetwalker]

There are always mistakes that no country will admit to unless they have to. Israel is no different.

I will prefer to go wherever the evidence leads me but the jury is still out right now.

The evidence is that Israel were in peace talks with the Saudi when Hamas struck , the Hospital got bombed when Biden was on route to talk of restraint to Israel and peace with Arab nations .

Who does that benefit ?
ans, the religion of death 

[Nick]

Bollocks. You are truly desperate when you have to quote a magazine run by and for fundamentalist Christians who believe in bible prophecies and whose mission statement is to sell that to people. Quote a more reliable source of you want me to listen

As for Gandhi being a terrorist because he bowed to the inevitable and accepted partition when all along he wanted muslims and hindus to live together in peace you are stretching the definition of terrorist to an utterly ludicrous extent. Gandhi was never the driving force behind partition. That it was done so quickly was down to us wanting to get the hell out whatever the cost.

And believing in partition of a nation in no way is akin to being a terrorist anyway. The communal strife was largely due to the haste with which we fucked off out of it, but it was almost inevitable to some degree. Gandhi was never the driving force behind any of that.

Stupid people say stupid things and intelligent people say intelligent things, But as an intelligent person you are in a class of your own with your regular propensity for saying stupid things, but the arse you are making of yourself right now surpasses anything I have seen so far. A lot of thought must be required to invent fake facts of such obvious silliness. Perhaps I should join in by stating that Mother Theresa was a terrorist, maybe, or Kylie Minogue is really the gun toting leader of the Australia Expat Liberation Front?

In a minute you will be trying to tell us that Jesus was a terrorist because he believed in and preached a higher authority than Rome, and founded a religion which later burnt and tortured their way around Europe and then the wider world.

But come out with any old crap you want, I am done with this nonsense. Some purported facts are so demonstrably utter bollocks that it is not worth anyones time trying to engage with it. If I want to put my mind in a parallel universe and fake reality, I'll read some science fiction.

Get yourself on a plane to India and speak to the people, Gandhi is roundly hated by Indians, but you carry on believing the BS sold to you. Like it or not Partition caused millions of deaths. 

Clearly it is your day off and you've hit the sauce, not a good look. 

[srb7677]

Can I ask where you are getting your figures for civilian deaths in Gaza?
How many does your source say have died?

I believe that 1400+ Israelis were killed by Hamas.
About 2,000 Hamas terrorists were killed in Israel as the IDF wiped them out.
I don't have many figures for Hamas or civilian deaths in Gaza. I do hope you are not relying on the "Gazan health ministry", because it is Hamas.

In matters such as this I tend to go for a variety of sources. This includes the BBC, Al Jazeera, Sky News, LBC radio, Channel 4 News, and reputable magazines like the New Statesman. I will also read online anything posted by the more reputable elements of our newsprint media, if it is not behind a paywall. And by that I essentially mean the broadsheets regardless of their political leanings. Also the I newspaper. I avoid unreliable news outlets altogether, including the Mail, the Express, the Sun, the Mirror, and the Star and avoid broadcast media with an obvious domestic political agenda like GB News who seem more interested in selling opinions to us than reporting news.

I do not get my information from Hamas.com,

[srb7677]

The Israelis admit their mistakes. They did not fire on the hospital.

There are always mistakes that no country will admit to unless they have to. Israel is no different.

I will prefer to go wherever the evidence leads me but the jury is still out right now.