Canterbury MP Rosie Duffield quits Labour

[Borg Refinery]

Nope, he is trying the best he can and is a man of integrity, wants the country to do and be better, he just has a different way of doing it

Most politicians have taken gifts for a long time, it's a seemingly normal and accepted practice. I'm not condemning Farage for taking gifts either, he's doing what they've all done and is also a man of integrity

I will not condemn. I just want the practice changed.

[Streetwalker]

He isn't trying to bluster, he has fair and legitimate points in this and many discussions and believes in high standards for public office, that's all.

The practice should be reformed but Starmer should not be condemned for it, he's a man with integrity and trying his best as PM

Are we thinking of the same person ? Maybe there are two of him . That he took the freebies puts him front and center with his nose buried deep in the trough . He has stood on being a man of integrity ,

He's not .

[Borg Refinery]

He isn't trying to bluster, he has fair and legitimate points in this and many discussions and believes in high standards for public office, that's all.

The practice should be reformed but Starmer should not be condemned for it, he's a man with integrity and trying his best as PM

[Unlucky4Sum]

How can you say 'proof is immaterial' but that we 'know' he was given access for the presents..?

Because he's trying to bluster his way out of fair challenge to his big and clearly dubious allegation of bribery

[Streetwalker]

But that's not how it works SW

You elect an MP to go to the palace of Westminster there to govern OR loyally opposed according to their best judgement in the best interests of their electorate

We all know that some MPs choosing to abandon the party whip chose to resign and stand again, giving their electorate the choice to dump them or keep them, and we all know how that went

Personally I think if she were my MP and she did this I'd vote for her and I've never voted for the party

But currently under English law she has no obligation to sacrifice herself.

And the scumbag Alan Howarth who stabbed Major in the back and became the Labour MP for Stratford Upon Avon refused to resign....

Yes I appreciate that , just that I would be right peed off if I had voted for someone and they jumped ship .The only saving grace is that she has gone independent and not joined another party . As for voting for her I think I will have that chance next time around if the house move goes to plan

[Nick]

Agree with J — even if a majority of voters vote for a party and couldn't care less who the candidates are.

It's for this reason I'd prefer the choice of party leader to be left solely to MPs and not to party members...

Do you not think the HoC's is incestuous enough already?

[patman post]

Agree with J — even if a majority of voters vote for a party and couldn't care less who the candidates are.

It's for this reason I'd prefer the choice of party leader to be left solely to MPs and not to party members...

[johnofgwent]

This one needs a bye -election . If she wants to stand as an independent she needs to be elected as one .The people  that voted labour deserve better .

But that's not how it works SW

You elect an MP to go to the palace of Westminster there to govern OR loyally opposed according to their best judgement in the best interests of their electorate

We all know that some MPs choosing to abandon the party whip chose to resign and stand again, giving their electorate the choice to dump them or keep them, and we all know how that went

Personally I think if she were my MP and she did this I'd vote for her and I've never voted for the party

But currently under English law she has no obligation to sacrifice herself.

And the scumbag Alan Howarth who stabbed Major in the back and became the Labour MP for Stratford Upon Avon refused to resign....

[Borg Refinery]

You know and I know he was given access for the presents, proof is immaterial.
Exactly, what niceties did he buy Bliar that we don't know about. What we do know is that a new incumbent government has never been hit with controversy and a drop in ratings so early on in its tenure as this shower of 💩.

How can you say 'proof is immaterial' but that we 'know' he was given access for the presents..?

[srb7677]

Massive tactical voting, I don't think so. There was a massive lack of voting, that's what gifted Labour their majority.

The evidence is clear that there was massive tactical voting amongst those who voted.

But yes there were also a lot who didn't vote at all.

Either way, support for Labour was lukewarm at best. Like I said, support for them was never very certain to start with.

[Nick]

Support for Labour this time was never very great to start with. They were primarily the beneficiaries of massive tactical voting against the Tories. The outcome of the election resulted from a massive anti-Tory vote much more than a vote for Labour. When a party of government overstays it's welcome, people are inclined to vote for whoever has the best chance of beating them where they are, regardless of who that is.

But such mass tactical voting tends to operate against governing parties rather than opposition ones. So Labour is highly unlikely to benefit from anything remotely resembling the same level of tactical voting come the next election. Their majority is vast but fragile, built upon very slender foundations. It could collapse as easily as it was built. All depends on how people rate Labour come the next election. This far out, what people think of them scarcely matters. But as the next election draws nearer it will begin to matter a lot more.

Massive tactical voting, I don't think so. There was a massive lack of voting, that's what gifted Labour their majority. 

[srb7677]

You know and I know he was given access for the presents, proof is immaterial.
Exactly, what niceties did he buy Bliar that we don't know about. What we do know is that a new incumbent government has never been hit with controversy and a drop in ratings so early on in its tenure as this shower of 💩.

Support for Labour this time was never very great to start with. They were primarily the beneficiaries of massive tactical voting against the Tories. The outcome of the election resulted from a massive anti-Tory vote much more than a vote for Labour. When a party of government overstays it's welcome, people are inclined to vote for whoever has the best chance of beating them where they are, regardless of who that is.

But such mass tactical voting tends to operate against governing parties rather than opposition ones. So Labour is highly unlikely to benefit from anything remotely resembling the same level of tactical voting come the next election. Their majority is vast but fragile, built upon very slender foundations. It could collapse as easily as it was built. All depends on how people rate Labour come the next election. This far out, what people think of them scarcely matters. But as the next election draws nearer it will begin to matter a lot more.

[Nick]

Many other people are given passes to Downing Street, incl Dominic Cummings most famously, he deserved a pass too given he was an advisor to the PM whether official or unofficial and people shouldn't assume the worst about Boris Johnson either, I did and I was mistaken.

There's no proof the pass was given in return for the donations, Alli has been a 'fixer' and advisor for the Labour Party since he was made a peer by Tony Blair in 1998. He's already a Labour lord and helper/advisor/fixer for the party so why would they bribe members of their own party who have already done similar things for them? He's been donating since 1998 and even before that

You know and I know he was given access for the presents, proof is immaterial. 
Exactly, what niceties did he buy Bliar that we don't know about. What we do know is that a new incumbent government has never been hit with controversy and a drop in ratings so early on in its tenure as this shower of 💩. 

[Nick]

Dominic Cummings was given an access all areas pass, not just for 10 Downing Street.

Cummins was chief advisor and wasn't buying presents for Boris, big difference. 

[Borg Refinery]

He has been given an all access Downing Street pass, which no other bugger gets, so YES, he has got some bang for his buck: which is bribery.

Many other people are given passes to Downing Street, incl Dominic Cummings most famously, he deserved a pass too given he was an advisor to the PM whether official or unofficial and people shouldn't assume the worst about Boris Johnson either, I did and I was mistaken.

There's no proof the pass was given in return for the donations, Alli has been a 'fixer' and advisor for the Labour Party since he was made a peer by Tony Blair in 1998. He's already a Labour lord and helper/advisor/fixer for the party so why would they bribe members of their own party who have already done similar things for them? He's been donating since 1998 and even before that