A deal has been reached!!!!

[Nick]

I wonder if that is the reason for his quiet confidence.

That and fact that Junker has said there will be no extension. Apparently they have put the word out to the hateful 21 that those still unaffiliated have a lifeline back to the whip.

[T00ts]

Thats what it looks like but apparently there is a loop hole in it according to lawyers. I'm sure Boris's multi million pound barristers know what it is but all I know is it is because Boris has obtained a deal.

I wonder if that is the reason for his quiet confidence.

[Nick]

I thought the Benn act stated that he must request an extension without a deal o with a deal that didn't pass the HofC.

Thats what it looks like but apparently there is a loop hole in it according to lawyers. I'm sure Boris's multi million pound barristers know what it is but all I know is it is because Boris has obtained a deal.

[T00ts]

There's just one small problem with that.  He doesn't actually have the legal power to rule it out.



This is just putting pressure on MPs.



Apart from anything else, it would be pointless to refuse an extension because then MPs might revoke which is in effect a 2 years extension.



If the deal passes, and it sticks (requires further votes to be passed as well to make it properly legal), at least this means 2 years of status quo - during this time I expect many people including me to put in place their plans to leave the UK in the long term.



However, as I've said, if the deal passes it will be democratic by the HOC - therefore that is ok.  What I didn't agree with is trying to make no deal happen be default by closing down the HOC and other dirty tricks.



Some people don't understand that you can reluctantly accept something when it's been legitimately voted on by the HOC, whilst disagreeing with it.  There is a difference between accepting something and agreeing with it.



All that said, I also wouldn't be at all surprised if this all starts to fall apart within a few hours.

There's just one small problem with that.  He doesn't actually have the legal power to rule it out.

That's where your wrong, the Benn act states he must ask for an extension in the event of NO DEAL. He has a deal so now that act is defunct, if the HoC doesn't agree the deal he doesn't have to ask for the extension.

I thought the Benn act stated that he must request an extension without a deal o with a deal that didn't pass the HofC.

[Nick]

There's just one small problem with that.  He doesn't actually have the legal power to rule it out.



This is just putting pressure on MPs.



Apart from anything else, it would be pointless to refuse an extension because then MPs might revoke which is in effect a 2 years extension.



If the deal passes, and it sticks (requires further votes to be passed as well to make it properly legal), at least this means 2 years of status quo - during this time I expect many people including me to put in place their plans to leave the UK in the long term.



However, as I've said, if the deal passes it will be democratic by the HOC - therefore that is ok.  What I didn't agree with is trying to make no deal happen be default by closing down the HOC and other dirty tricks.



Some people don't understand that you can reluctantly accept something when it's been legitimately voted on by the HOC, whilst disagreeing with it.  There is a difference between accepting something and agreeing with it.



All that said, I also wouldn't be at all surprised if this all starts to fall apart within a few hours.

There's just one small problem with that.  He doesn't actually have the legal power to rule it out.

That's where your wrong, the Benn act states he must ask for an extension in the event of NO DEAL. He has a deal so now that act is defunct, if the HoC doesn't agree the deal he doesn't have to ask for the extension.

[Major Sinic]

The most single important aspect for the UK economy is the right to negotiate our own trade agreements. To me every other aspect is secondary. It is my belief that within five years the UK, or the bulk which remains, will economically have eclipsed every other European nation in terms of GDP per capita and individual prosperity. The EU is already showing signs of being a moribund mass slowing down and oblivious to the competition and opportunities elsewhere on our planet. I believe the UK, and yes I suppose I do really mean England, has a great number of cards in its favour.



This has to be better than NO DEAL although if the Remainers through ideology and hubris vote down the deal, I accept NO DEAL is second best.

[Nick]

Beeb confirming it. I don't think the DUP is on board, so it won't get through Parliament unless BJ thinks he can win them over by Saturday. Plus the looming court case.



Reuters also confirming it.

Not just Dup but Corbyn saying no a Swinson too,we need a GE.

Don't think any of the Remainers want a GE, Boris with a 50+ majority and a deal to get us out. As for this using the courts at every turn, when did that become a legal use of the judiciary?

[Streetwalker]

The deal is a poor one . Johnson has done nothing but tweak with the backstop  The rest of it is Mayhems WA which was rejected by parliament  3 times .



I expect it to be rejected again and we can get on with preparing for a no deal ,WTO , Brexit .

True, but there are a few riders.



I don't trust Boris, but I do trust his self interest. The problem with Mrs May was that there was always the thought that whatever deal she came up with, she was really trying to rejoin the EU. Boris knows that if he wants to stay PM he needs the Brexit vote. So he can either get a half arsed deal and still pick up the reluctant votes of a lot of Brexit Party voters, or have Parliament refuse the deal, get kicked out of the EU and do the same thing.

Lets hope its the latter . My main gripe with the 'deal' is that is not a deal ,an agreement or a way forward . It is an international treaty that binds the UK to the EU on many issues . If this is leaving Id rather stay in .  At least we could look forward to the day that we elect a government that would  actually be united in taking us out .

If Johnson was serious about leaving he would be rejecting the EU's terms of withdrawal not saying its a good deal . He has lost support as both Cameron and then May did with coming back from Brussels with such a poor agreement for the UK . His rep will hinge on if he takes us out , no deal style after he has lost the vote on Saturday .

[patman post]

No further ahead than Mrs May's deal, if fact lagging behind — she actually got it voted on in parliament...

[Borchester]

The deal is a poor one . Johnson has done nothing but tweak with the backstop  The rest of it is Mayhems WA which was rejected by parliament  3 times .



I expect it to be rejected again and we can get on with preparing for a no deal ,WTO , Brexit .

True, but there are a few riders.



I don't trust Boris, but I do trust his self interest. The problem with Mrs May was that there was always the thought that whatever deal she came up with, she was really trying to rejoin the EU. Boris knows that if he wants to stay PM he needs the Brexit vote. So he can either get a half arsed deal and still pick up the reluctant votes of a lot of Brexit Party voters, or have Parliament refuse the deal, get kicked out of the EU and do the same thing.

[Streetwalker]

The deal is a poor one . Johnson has done nothing but tweak with the backstop  The rest of it is Mayhems WA which was rejected by parliament  3 times .



I expect it to be rejected again and we can get on with preparing for a no deal ,WTO , Brexit .

[Conchúr]

To all those who called Boris a liar when he said he was trying to get a deal done, you all got it wrong. Boris against all the odds has secured an equitable deal to leave the EU.

The deal achieved is essentially a slightly more complicated version of what the EU and Ireland had argued for before and had been rejected by Brexiteers as the EU trying to "annex" Northern Ireland.



There are also elements to the Deal which I think Brexiteers are going to struggle with.  The Political Declaration attached to the agreement, which is the 'road map' for the future relationship, retains the robust commitments made by Theresa May that the UK will honour the principle of a "level playing field" on things like state aid, competition, social and employment standards, the environment, climate change and some tax matters.  It also commits to a zero tariff free trade agreement with the EU.  



In short, this is a commitment to close alignment with the EU and a blow to the idea that the UK will pursue some Singapore-style strategy to undercut the EU competitively.

[Javert]

There's just one small problem with that.  He doesn't actually have the legal power to rule it out.



This is just putting pressure on MPs.



Apart from anything else, it would be pointless to refuse an extension because then MPs might revoke which is in effect a 2 years extension.



If the deal passes, and it sticks (requires further votes to be passed as well to make it properly legal), at least this means 2 years of status quo - during this time I expect many people including me to put in place their plans to leave the UK in the long term.



However, as I've said, if the deal passes it will be democratic by the HOC - therefore that is ok.  What I didn't agree with is trying to make no deal happen be default by closing down the HOC and other dirty tricks.



Some people don't understand that you can reluctantly accept something when it's been legitimately voted on by the HOC, whilst disagreeing with it.  There is a difference between accepting something and agreeing with it.



All that said, I also wouldn't be at all surprised if this all starts to fall apart within a few hours.

[Cassie]

Just said that on the other thread, that has put the cat amongst the pigeons. If they take over the order of proceedings they might have to vote to revoke article 50, that might not go down too well. Not delivering Brexit will be solely on the unelected minority 'government.'

Which also suggests that the Remainers are trying to stay in a club that wants to see the back of them.  

 :hattip  

[Borchester]

Just said that on the other thread, that has put the cat amongst the pigeons. If they take over the order of proceedings they might have to vote to revoke article 50, that might not go down too well. Not delivering Brexit will be solely on the unelected minority 'government.'

Which also suggests that the Remainers are trying to stay in a club that wants to see the back of them.