It'll be tough!

[T00ts]

Seriously, why are you all panicking so much. Unless you are very old, or have an underlying medical condition you will be OK. Of course, it won't be much fun, but neither is flu or a bad cold. We have the best part of 8 billion human beings infesting the planet, so if we lose a few million, does it really matter that much ?



On another point, Ebola was far more dangerous, and equally as contagious, so why didn't that become a pandemic ?

Because with Ebola you could see it coming. Covid19 is infectious before the symptoms are felt or seen. As for your comment on it only hits the old - I suggest you keep up with the news a little better. It is attacking all ages. In Italy many are in their 20's and 30's and it's not a sniffle, they are on oxygen for severe pneumonia. In case you haven't noticed people in chronic pain and inability to breathe are arriving at hospitals in greater numbers than are leaving, hence the hospitals getting swamped. This is already happening in London with staff at their wits end trying to help people get better. Normal flu does not become chronic pneumonia in as many patients. This is not normal flu and I think there is little doubt that if allowed to run it's course the resultant number of deaths will be more than any of us can imagine. I take it you have no parents or other relatives that you care about and are assuming that you are not on the death list. I hope you are right.

[Wiggles]

Seriously, why are you all panicking so much. Unless you are very old, or have an underlying medical condition you will be OK. Of course, it won't be much fun, but neither is flu or a bad cold. We have the best part of 8 billion human beings infesting the planet, so if we lose a few million, does it really matter that much ?



On another point, Ebola was far more dangerous, and equally as contagious, so why didn't that become a pandemic ?

[T00ts]

Its regional and local NHS administration managers that appear to have badly let the front line medical troops down. I've heard complaints for years about how admin is overstaffed and has grown lazy and accustomed to box-ticking in consequence. Perhaps now drafting half the admin staff to front line cleaning, portering, and reception duties might reduce a bit of the stress of medical staff who are currently putting in 12 to 14+ hour days...

 :hattip

[patman post]

No blaming cuts simply isn't good enough. They have equipment in store which was from when the preparation was made for a no deal Brexit.  The NHS bosses have repeatedly said that there is no shortage just that it's a distribution problem. There is no ex use.  They have let the front line down yet again and still hold on to their highly paid jobs.

Its regional and local NHS administration managers that appear to have badly let the front line medical troops down. I've heard complaints for years about how admin is overstaffed and has grown lazy and accustomed to box-ticking in consequence. Perhaps now drafting half the admin staff to front line cleaning, portering, and reception duties might reduce a bit of the stress of medical staff who are currently putting in 12 to 14+ hour days...

[patman post]

Germany has 60000 ventilators, the NHS had 5500. Although anaesthetic machines can be converted quite easily into ventilators that won't address the shortage.

However anyone tries to spin it ten years of cuts has had a dramatic effect. There has been no slack in the system for a long time.

In Germany, where hospitals had about 20,000 ventilators before the outbreak, the government has placed an order for 10,000 machines from Draegerwerk – the equivalent to a year's normal production at the company.

https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-health-coronavirus-ventilators-insigh/army-joins-the-production-line-as-ventilator-makers-scramble-to-meet-demand-idUKKBN2180JQ">https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-healt ... KKBN2180JQ">https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-health-coronavirus-ventilators-insigh/army-joins-the-production-line-as-ventilator-makers-scramble-to-meet-demand-idUKKBN2180JQ

Enough said — though the whole article of two days ago is interesting...

[T00ts]

Oh good it looks as though things have speeded up. Lunchtime for the home workers perhaps.



I have just spoken to a neighbour whose daughter is an ITU sister at the local hospital. They are just gearing up. They have 30 critical care beds with cases in already but not yet confirmed and no they don't have all the right protective gear yet.

[cromwell]

Where have you heard that?

At our local hospital they are all kitted up and stocked up. I saw the extra pallets of goods coming in at least 3 weeks ago.

This is first hand knowledge, not what the press are saying. In London in might be different.  :shrg:

Medics saying it Barry not just the press.



Anyway as I said a bit back I reckon the police might struggle at times and the military will be needed

https://www.yorkshireeveningpost.co.uk/news/crime/large-crowds-coughing-police-and-spitting-when-asked-move-back-during-serious-incident-yorkshire-2504820">//https://www.yorkshireeveningpost.co.uk/news/crime/large-crowds-coughing-police-and-spitting-when-asked-move-back-during-serious-incident-yorkshire-2504820

[Barry]

 I fear that once again with all the evidence even from Italy before we were aware of infection here we knew it was coming for weeks and yet we hear that medics don't even have protective equipment...

Where have you heard that?

At our local hospital they are all kitted up and stocked up. I saw the extra pallets of goods coming in at least 3 weeks ago.

This is first hand knowledge, not what the press are saying. In London in might be different.  :shrg:

[papasmurf]

(It is taking so long to load today I am going to take a break after this post)



I find it impossible to believe that no matter cuts or no cuts the NHS would not have had enough equipment for this situation. We need thousands of ventilators. 30,000 has been mentioned as a minimum.

Germany has 60000 ventilators, the NHS had 5500. Although anaesthetic machines can be converted quite easily into ventilators that won't address the shortage.

However anyone tries to spin it ten years of cuts has had a dramatic effect. There has been no slack in the system for a long time.

[T00ts]

There is a massive shortage of equipment and that is a direct result of ten years of cuts. There was no stockpiling of ventilators, in fact if you ask anyone involved a lot other equipment needed is broken down and not been repaired.

It has been a disaster waiting to happen for years any major incident would have caused problems.

The same applies to the ambulance service and the fire brigade. Britain has not been prepared for a major disaster due to cuts for a long time.

(It is taking so long to load today I am going to take a break after this post)



I find it impossible to believe that no matter cuts or no cuts the NHS would not have had enough equipment for this situation. We need thousands of ventilators. 30,000 has been mentioned as a minimum. They would never have had them. My prime concern at this point is the protective clothing which they profess to have and yet nurses etc are having to buy their own from DIY stores etc. Some nurses are now refusing to go in because they haven't got the right protection. That is unforgivable. There are some very important questions about the NHS competency at the top. Management at the NHS has been a dirty word for years. We have all known it. Too many  sitting in offices and worrying about their carpets than what is going on on the front line. It's time for change.

[papasmurf]

No blaming cuts simply isn't good enough. They have equipment in store which was from when the preparation was made for a no deal Brexit.  The NHS bosses have repeatedly said that there is no shortage just that it's a distribution problem. There is no ex use.  They have let the front line down yet again and still hold on to their highly paid jobs.

There is a massive shortage of equipment and that is a direct result of ten years of cuts. There was no stockpiling of ventilators, in fact if you ask anyone involved a lot other equipment needed is broken down and not been repaired.

It has been a disaster waiting to happen for years any major incident would have caused problems.

The same applies to the ambulance service and the fire brigade. Britain has not been prepared for a major disaster due to cuts for a long time.

[T00ts]

Ten years of cuts to the NHS has left the NHS VERY vulnerable to such an emergency as Covid-19.

I was never a matter of if, but when.

No blaming cuts simply isn't good enough. They have equipment in store which was from when the preparation was made for a no deal Brexit.  The NHS bosses have repeatedly said that there is no shortage just that it's a distribution problem. There is no ex use.  They have let the front line down yet again and still hold on to their highly paid jobs.

[Streetwalker]

Ten years of cuts to the NHS has left the NHS VERY vulnerable to such an emergency as Covid-19.

I was never a matter of if, but when.

Regardless of spending on the NHS not keeping up with demand  you would be the first one to complain if further 'cuts' were made to stockpile equipment for potential pandemics .

Any failure is not because of spending in the past but what the government is prepared to spend as the pandemic strikes .  So far it seems they are doing what they can , the future will tell us wether their response is deemed a failure .

[papasmurf]

 Why weren't the NHS prepared?

Ten years of cuts to the NHS has left the NHS VERY vulnerable to such an emergency as Covid-19.

It was never a matter of if, but when.

[papasmurf]

 Why weren't the NHS prepared?

Ten years of cuts to the NHS has left the NHS VERY vulnerable to such an emergency as Covid-19.

I was never a matter of if, but when.