How well is the government handling the pandemic?

[T00ts]

So we are now nearly 5 weeks into lockdown.



The hospital death toll is just over 20k



The estimated overall deaths (Inc care homes etc) over 40k



We appear to have hit the peak of both infections and deaths (though I would wait until tomorrow's all deaths to 17 April come out being more than hopeful).



The government has recently reversed it's position that test and trace is unimportant and aligned with (pretty much) the test of the world on this.



It recently introduced restrictions on people entering the country (again moving into line with the rest of the world)



The nightingale hospitals remain nearly unused, though some of that appears to be because if staffing shortages.



Front line staff still seem to be experiencing PPE shortages.



The ventilator program "last gasp" seems to have more or less wound down having provided no ventilators (though a cynic might argue a lot of headlines). The fact we didn't run out of ventilators is a good sign, because it seems doubtful the program would have been able to provide any if they had been required.



So, what is people's assessment of how the gov has done/is doing?

I have already started a thread that asks if the buck is being allocated to the wrong place. Yes the government has overall control but for me there have been numerous failings from those in organisational positions who have simply not done their jobs efficiently. Until this is over no-one will be hung out to dry and yes in part it is a shambles. Just who could/would have done it better, with fewer deaths and healthier economy? I think this is one black hole that would have caught most leaders out.

[BeElBeeBub]

So we are now nearly 5 weeks into lockdown.



The hospital death toll is just over 20k



The estimated overall deaths (Inc care homes etc) over 40k



We appear to have hit the peak of both infections and deaths (though I would wait until tomorrow's all deaths to 17 April come out being more than hopeful).



The government has recently reversed it's position that test and trace is unimportant and aligned with (pretty much) the test of the world on this.



It recently introduced restrictions on people entering the country (again moving into line with the rest of the world)



The nightingale hospitals remain nearly unused, though some of that appears to be because if staffing shortages.



Front line staff still seem to be experiencing PPE shortages.



The ventilator program "last gasp" seems to have more or less wound down having provided no ventilators (though a cynic might argue a lot of headlines). The fact we didn't run out of ventilators is a good sign, because it seems doubtful the program would have been able to provide any if they had been required.



So, what is people's assessment of how the gov has done/is doing?

[Javert]

Might I suggest the first time this group of scientific amateurs decides to overrule the scientific / governmental advice we all just give up, catch COVID19 and get it over with.

I have some sympathy with this view and I have also been thinking along these lines.



However, what I would add is that even if there is a case for this right now, there should be an active effort to force the government to commit to a wide ranging Public Inquiry, with the terms of reference and the inquiry itself being independently set, independently executed, and without limitation on the scope.



Further, if it is found that large numbers of people died through political interference, and that the government made ideological decisions to delay the lockdown implementation, or to prepare for the pandemic in February, the government should have the courage to call a General Election in early 2022 (after the inquiry in 2021) and ask the people to decide whether their initial negligence was outweighed by their later crisis management competence.  Of course I have little to no hope that the government would to this, but actually, if they did, I would respect them a lot more.



To be clear, I'm not saying that this is definitely the case, but I have my suspicions and this should most definitely be investigated.



There are also those who argue that if these questions are not asked right now instead of next year, the government will be able to find ways to sweep them under the carpet.



This will be difficult to do once most people in the country have a friend, family member or acquaintance who has died or been seriously affected from Covid-19 or its indirect effects - it will be much harder for the government to sweep things under the rug when most people in the country have seen for themselves the difference between what it really happening and what politicians are spinning.



Most of the right wing newspapers are trying to turn the entire affair into a personality cult based around the Prime Minister, but frankly not many people read those papers these days anyway, and I wouldn't be surprised if even some right wing people start to think twice once they see their own family member pass away from this whilst their newspaper talks about which movies the heroic Boris Johnson is watching and how strong he must be to have recovered etc. ect.

[Barry]

Welcome to the forum kwhs10.

Might I suggest the first time this group of scientific amateurs decides to overrule the scientific / governmental advice we all just give up, catch COVID19 and get it over with.

It's a valid point of view. Some would say we are merely extending the agony, and by tanking the economy and printing money creating even greater problems for the future.

Then there's possible social effects as will be caused by "cabin fever" if this lock-down continues longer than the public perception of need allows for.

[kwhs10]

Personally I hope the government is not handling the pandemic. Their attitude appears to be they are following the scientific and medical advice which means the technical experts are handing the pandemic and government is just turning this advice into actions throughout society. Which is why I am somewhat disturbed to hear MP's want to be recalled to provide "SCRUTINY". Is anyone else worried that the recommendations of a small band of experts in epidemiology, virology and other health and medical disciplines, individuals with tens of years of academic and hands on experience in the required fields, will now be over-ruled by a group of 600 know it all MP's with a few minutes on wikipedia to their name.



Perhaps the Oxford English Dictionary should re-write the definition of

SCRUTINY  

The ability to interfere with the political process regardless of the benefits or detriments to the objective, provided the detriments are easily explainable as someone else's fault, for the purposes of advancing ones career and hopefully attaining a position of power.



Might I suggest the first time this group of scientific amateurs decides to overrule the scientific / governmental advice we all just give up, catch COVID19 and get it over with.

[papasmurf]

so now' were another week or so in to things, what are people's thoughts?

Despite the two letters I have had implying if I go outside over the next 12 weeks I am going to die, today I had to go for an appointment for post operative check on some eye surgery. I had more PPE kit than the opthalmologist. Who had none.

 

I would email my (Tory,) MP to complain, but would be wasting my time.

[Javert]

Later on there will be reckoning on various topics during the enquiry.  Things like



1) Why did the government do so little to prepare for this during the months of Feb and early March?

2) What is the real story behind the European procurement proposals.  The government has openly admitted incompetence, so probably the truth is much worse.

3) Why is the government being so cagey on testing and testing ability.

4) Why are so many people being tested more than once (a question the media has completely failed to ask even though presented with the data on plate last Monday).

5) What is the effect on the accuracy of the test when they are telling people not to get tested until they are almost dying and therefore often in the 6th-8th day of symptoms (I have it on authority from several medical professionals that the test is much more likely to give a false negative result after about 5 days and this is happening quite a bit in our local hospital i.e. patients that they are certain have Covid-19 testing negative twice).

[BeElBeeBub]

so now' were another week or so in to things, what are people's thoughts?



anyone changing their minds on how well the government is handling things?



There have been some notable success stories, chiefly the build out of NHS Nightingale in Excel which is an astonishing achievement, though I not one that politicians seemed to have very little to do with other than to say "go" to the army team that managed the build out.  



To my mind the jury is still out on the various "Dyson/JCB/RR" ventilator schemes, lots of noise but seemingly very few deliveries as yet. However it is early days and I appreciate that production ramp ups take time (which was always the point)



Related, the saga of why the UK isn't participating in the EU bulk buy seems to have been, at best a cock up and at worst a massive dereliction of duty. The  reason for why we aren't participating seems to have morphed from "we can't because we're not in the EU" to "we didn't get the email" to "<SHRUGS>"



The testing situation seem to have been terribly handled.  Again the government's reasons and position seem to shift regularly - in itself no bad thing - but when they go from

When the WHO talks about testing, it is addressing the global system. Not all countries have the same infrastructure as the UK and there are countries that the WHO needs to press on testing

on Wednesday to

Increasing testing capacity is the government's top priority, and we are working around the clock and across the country to rapidly boost capacity

today?



it seems very "Oceania had always been at war with Eastasia"

[Wiggles]

Probably being handled as well as can be expected. It's very difficult to draw a balance between health and the economy. I would have let it run it's course, and taken the "survival of the fittest" direction, but that may not have been very popular amongst those who may die.

[BeElBeeBub]

The local butcher will have plenty of meat because all the pubs hotels and restaurants are shut.

the problem was getting it delivered from the wholesalers to the shop, the wholesalers were short of drivers as 11 were isolating either because they had symptoms or a family member did.



Coupled with extra demand it was leaving the counter a bit bare.



Wen today and there was  stock although sold out of a few items.

[patman post]

::



Well, you know, it's always about maximising profit, which means maximum bull.

Trouble is Tesco was so enthusiastic about profit it mis-stated (discovered an accounting problem with/exaggerated) its forecast for first half 2014, and the FCA became involved...

https://www.fca.org.uk/news/press-releases/tesco-pay-redress-market-abuse">https://www.fca.org.uk/news/press-relea ... rket-abuse">https://www.fca.org.uk/news/press-releases/tesco-pay-redress-market-abuse

[T00ts]

::



Well, you know, it's always about maximising profit, which means maximum bull.



Where has the like button gone?  Has it been quarantined?

No it died and got buried for slowing things down too much.

[Scott777]

But over the years, Tesco's PR dept have been very high on bull...

 ::



Well, you know, it's always about maximising profit, which means maximum bull.



Where has the like button gone?  Has it been quarantined?

[patman post]

But the again, if no one is going out to eat, they are buying all that meat themselves.  I must say, Tesco is very low on pork.

But over the years, Tesco's PR dept have been very high on bull...

[papasmurf]

Due to tourists and second home owners taking no notice of the lockdown and camper vans that were thrown off of campsites parking up all over the place a large notice has been put up at the entrance to the village:- " "This Village is Self Isolating. Go home Save Lives"