Only one speed

[papasmurf]

This time we're going to try tablets first. I don't feel like spending a week in COVID plague hell....

After watching the Channel 4 news report last night from a Welsh hospital I agree with you.

[Thomas]

This time we're going to try tablets first. I don't feel like spending a week in COVID plague hell....

Look after yerself john. :thup:

[Thomas]

Interesting article on "herd immunity"

https://www.debka.com/seeking-the-elusive-herd-effect-to-beat-back-coronavirus-2/">//https://www.debka.com/seeking-the-elusive-herd-effect-to-beat-back-coronavirus-2/

Not sure i agree with that article barry.( read most but not all of it , and who the feck is sharon mikhailov?)



Like most folk , i have no medical knowledge , and i certainly have never worked for the SNHS , but you said some thing to me the other day along the lines that the WHO`s Tedros Adhanom had it wrong on the general advice and strategy that they were issuing to the world over covid 19.



The insinuation was the "uk government" and "uk scientists" like whitty and vallance knew best.



"herd immunity" strategy keeps popping up week after week in some form or another  as some" viable strategy backed up by scientific advice."



I would question that barry , with my limited knowledge.



Why is it very few , if any countries around the world are following this "herd immunity " strategy much vaunted initialy by the uk government advisors?( and then quietly dropped , with government lickspittles being sent out to deny it was ever really considered?)



Certainly from what i can see , most countries around the world , and especially in europe , seem to be following the WHO advice of lockdown , test and trace  , while the uk government dithers on a lockdown that isnt really a lockdown ,  , and up till yesterday Scotland was testing far more (42% more) people than your country was.



We have had world leaders , for example from new zealands jacinda ardern , to donald trump , rubbish the "herd immunity " strategy.



I would say trump and ardern have very little in common , certainly politically , and i would also argue there is no world leader more desperate to get his economy up and running than mr Trump. Yet when asked about "herd immunity" as a viable strategy , Trumps retort was..

Trump on herd immunity: "well you know it's a concept, it's a concept - if you don't mind death."

[/b]



I appreciate  , from reading your posts over the last few weeks , you appear to be at least "open" to the idea of herd immunity as a viable way forward, but it does seem strange the vast majority of scientists , medical professionals , politicians  , health organisations and countries around the world dont?

"We never, *EVER* considered that as a possibility, *EVER*! Herd immunity would have meant tens of thousands of New Zealanders dying, and I simply would not tolerate that and I don't think any New Zealander would." - @jacindaardern

[/b]



https://twitter.com/UKDemockery/status/1244736103627849730">https://twitter.com/UKDemockery/status/ ... 3627849730">https://twitter.com/UKDemockery/status/1244736103627849730

[T00ts]

Well yesterday was ... interesting



Two days ago I was out pruning back the jungle that is JoG Towers' rear garden, an area my youngest attacked me with scissors for trying to prune a few years ago. As the kid in how to train your dragon points out, we are vikings, we have "stubborness issues"



Anyway, after several YEARS of nothing being done i read madam the riot act, she pissed off in a huff to her room, and i went out with a variety of brush cutters.



And ripped myself to shreds on thorns.



That was two days ago.



At 4.30pm yesterday I started to have uncontrollable fits of shivering. Thinking my blood sugar was gone to cock I tried the emergency drill for that, no good. So I retired to bed, with three duvets and enough paracetamol to kill an elephant.



By 9:30 the shivering stopped. Yes, five hours of uncontrollable tetanus-like shivering.







But at 2am my right leg started to hurt like hell.



I've only gone and got cellulitis again



I'm watching a band of redness creep up towards the knee



Fifteen years ago I went into a shit-filled scuba diving quarry where some utter idiot landed on me and wrenched my drysuit, sending several gallons of mucky water into the suit to join me. Climbing out of the lake, i stank like the creature from the black lagoon, and i emptied two full cans of lynx body spray over myself when the showers failed to dislodge the stench. My dive buddy Darren said "Jeez john, go careful with that stuff, ouve seen the adverts, you'll spend a week flat on your back being pandered to by gorgeous women.



Unknown to me I banged my knee getting out, and next thing i know my leg is bright red and swelling up. It feel just like the bends but it was an infection in the capillaries. At that time it was so bad, they sent me off to the inpatients at caerphilly miners to have intravenous antibiotics which were very, VERY unpleasant.



Darren came round to see how I was. And my first words to him were "you were right". It seems i am indeed condemned to spend a week flat on my back in bed being pandered to by gorgeous women. Sadly, all married.



This time we're going to try tablets first. I don't feel like spending a week in COVID plague hell....

Maybe it's time to put the Viking to sleep. Hope you feel better soon.  :hattip

[johnofgwent]

Well yesterday was ... interesting



Two days ago I was out pruning back the jungle that is JoG Towers' rear garden, an area my youngest attacked me with scissors for trying to prune a few years ago. As the kid in how to train your dragon points out, we are vikings, we have "stubborness issues"



Anyway, after several YEARS of nothing being done i read madam the riot act, she pissed off in a huff to her room, and i went out with a variety of brush cutters.



And ripped myself to shreds on thorns.



That was two days ago.



At 4.30pm yesterday I started to have uncontrollable fits of shivering. Thinking my blood sugar was gone to cock I tried the emergency drill for that, no good. So I retired to bed, with three duvets and enough paracetamol to kill an elephant.



By 9:30 the shivering stopped. Yes, five hours of uncontrollable tetanus-like shivering.



But at 2am my right leg started to hurt like hell.



I've only gone and got cellulitis again



I'm watching a band of redness creep up towards the knee



Fifteen years ago I went into a shit-filled scuba diving quarry where some utter idiot landed on me and wrenched my drysuit, sending several gallons of mucky water into the suit to join me. Climbing out of the lake, i stank like the creature from the black lagoon, and i emptied two full cans of lynx body spray over myself when the showers failed to dislodge the stench. My dive buddy Darren said "Jeez john, go careful with that stuff, ouve seen the adverts, you'll spend a week flat on your back being pandered to by gorgeous women.



Unknown to me I banged my knee getting out, and next thing i know my leg is bright red and swelling up. It feel just like the bends but it was an infection in the capillaries. At that time it was so bad, they sent me off to the inpatients at caerphilly miners to have intravenous antibiotics which were very, VERY unpleasant.



Darren came round to see how I was. And my first words to him were "you were right". It seems i am indeed condemned to spend a week flat on my back in bed being pandered to by gorgeous women. Sadly, all married.



This time we're going to try tablets first. I don't feel like spending a week in COVID plague hell....

[papasmurf]

Lucky the Duchy hospital is now pooling resources with the Royal Cornwall then...

I am aware of that but that won't help much as usually if a patient at the Duchy need some kind or emergency treatement they are wheeled across the road into the Royal Cornwall. (About forty feet door to door.)

[patman post]

It is the exact situation where I live, there are VERY few ICU beds. Promises of this week next week sometime never for any increases in ICU kit, ventilators, PPE kit, when too late was two months ago.

Lucky the Duchy hospital is now pooling resources with the Royal Cornwall then...

[Borchester]

I fear you are incorrect. The Maesteg example of patients being sent letters advising them of the BENEFITS to THEM of agreeing to die at home untreated is not an isolated case. Other NHS trusts are setting up for this.

Good.



With all due respect to Barry and all the other folk who have volunteered to help the NHS, I have the greatest respect for the former but not so much for the latter. Whatever this bug is, it isn't the Black Death, but the NHS is acting as though it is. So if push comes to shove I intend to spend my last hours in my own bed watching the Khan Academy and Charles Dowding on Youtube and with the womenfolk a respectful but safe two metres away. I love them dearly but don't need their advice on how to die.



As I have said before, all respect to Barry and Co, but when I see that sign Clap for the NHS, I can't help wondering why they should want to brag about it. Still, thank God for penicillin.

[Barry]

Interesting article on "herd immunity"

https://www.debka.com/seeking-the-elusive-herd-effect-to-beat-back-coronavirus-2/">//https://www.debka.com/seeking-the-elusive-herd-effect-to-beat-back-coronavirus-2/

[johnofgwent]

I don't think that's at all true at this point - this might only be the case if you catch it and there are not enough  ventilators available for everyone who needs them.



As of yesterday, there were still significant numbers of ventilator beds empty all across the country so if you were sick today and went in, you would get everything.



The race against time is to increase the number of ventilators faster than the number of arriving patients.  So far they are winning this race, but that's mainly because they have stolen ventilators from others places like operating theatres, private hospitals etc - now they have to get more from other sources.



Also not every patient needs a ventilator - my wife didn't need one even though she has asthma and recovered without one.



Probably too early, but I'm seeing mental image of Caracticus Potts creating a ventilator out of an old accordion and a bicycle, and getting the kids to pedel like mad to save granny.

I fear you are incorrect. The Maesteg example of patients being sent letters advising them of the BENEFITS to THEM of agreeing to die at home untreated is not an isolated case. Other NHS trusts are setting up for this.

[Thomas]

The lies coming from government about PPE being delivered when it is not should be prosecuted and penalised.

Very much so.



As England , and its parliament at westminster doesnt really have any effective opposition , as many have said it appears to be the journalists who are holding the conservative government to account.



Obviously patman post will be wanting folk like robert peston , and many other journalists who have exposed the uk governments lies over recent days , prosecuted for coming off message.



I have noticed that wae pat over the years , going back to the old forum and the days of the cameron government , how he likes to himself stay on message with the uk government and defends their position. With the exception of the johnson administration over brexit of course.



I also remember the time i fell off my office chair laughing when he inferred i wasnt scottish but some sort of russian bot spreading fake news.



Fake news seems to fast be becoming any sort of news or questioning of uk government policy that doesnt seem to be in line with the pish they come out with. The worrying trend is so called "moderates" more and more calling for prosecutions when government policy , and lies , are questioned or exposed.

[papasmurf]

. I believe it's a pity perpetrators cannot be prosecuted and penalised according to the possible harm they might do...

The lies coming from government about PPE being delivered when it is not should be prosecuted and penalised.

[patman post]

I do not trust NHS management at all. Especially when they are threatening staff who speak out about the equipment shortages.

Any problem NHS staff have reporting their concerns should be covered. But because different trusts seems to operate as separate fiefdoms, management bullies can probably be found.

https://www.england.nhs.uk/ourwork/whistleblowing/">https://www.england.nhs.uk/ourwork/whistleblowing/

https://improvement.nhs.uk/resources/whistleblowers-support-scheme/">https://improvement.nhs.uk/resources/wh ... rt-scheme/">https://improvement.nhs.uk/resources/whistleblowers-support-scheme/



But there is also the problem of accidental and deliberate misinformation the NHS (and government) faces. I believe it's a pity perpetrators cannot be prosecuted and penalised according to the possible harm they might do...

https://www.england.nhs.uk/2020/03/nhs-takes-action-against-coronavirus-fake-news-online/">https://www.england.nhs.uk/2020/03/nhs- ... ws-online/">https://www.england.nhs.uk/2020/03/nhs-takes-action-against-coronavirus-fake-news-online/

[T00ts]

I do not trust NHS management at all. Especially when they are threatening staff who speak out about the equipment shortages.

On this I am with you. For too long we have known or at least surmised that there are major problems in the NHS. Now is not the moment but I am hopeful that at the end of all this there is a root and branch accounting with pruning shears. The medic and nurses and everyone who has processed the poor people inflicted with this should have a medal, but as for the rest of them that swan around in charge well...

[papasmurf]

I thought you'd argue with official NHS advice.  :roll:

I do not trust NHS management at all. Especially when they are threatening staff who speak out about the equipment shortages.