Is anyone surprised? Ukraine invaded

[cromwell]

I didn't say Ukraine was Russian Good Old. But historically it was. If you want to ask me what has currently caused this tension, it was the stubbornness to not tell Zelensky he isn't getting NATO membership. The farce over that issue in particular for the last two months was probably the catalyst for all this and Russia I think wanted to send a message to Europe which is now loud and clear. Because if you are talking about security of Europe the first thing we can do is recognise that Ukraine is too close to Russia to think about militarization without a reaction and this is the reaction we will have if this goes on further. Ukraine as a buffer isn't just for Russian security it should be said, but ours as well. And as I said, I think talks will be successful because ultimately Russia want to prevent genocide and I can't see why Zelensky can't give up concessions here. Because Russia are now surrounding Keiv and although it won't be easy, the city will fall if Zelensky digs his heels much further.

Historically Ukraine is  Austro Hungarian,Polish,Historically France is ours,but we belong to Rome historically cobblers I'm afraid.

[B0ycey]

Putin, is taking the piss, out of Macron, every bit as much or more as he is with any other western statesman or woman.  What was yesterdays Macron, agreement.? Oh yes, Putin wouldn't target civilians . Outcome rockets hitting civilian areas all over the country.

Listen Good Old, you need to stop it. Missiles go off target. Do you think when we invaded Iraq they didn't kill civilians or apartment blocks? Russia make it clear today where they are attacking and asked people to stay away. That is a fucking win for Macron whether you accept that or not.

[B0ycey]

The drivel is all yours . Ukraine is not Russian territory. End of. The fact that he believes it is , is the real problem. Russia, could ,and in history even recent lays claims to everyone of its neighbours territory. Putins ambition lays in the past.  He doesn't need provocation  just excuse and those ancient claims are all the excuse he needs. Yes Ukraine has a seat in the UN. That should tell you their status. and as such they should under no circumstance have to endure him conducting a major military intrusion in all parts of Ukraine killing civilians and military alike under the excuse of being  a peace keeper.  The reason his actions are thought dangerous to Europe, is precisely because it's Europe he disrupts.  And because of the spurious nature of his reasoning , an open threat to the peace of Europe. As a so called peace keeper UN backing would have helped . He hasn't got it , in fact even the Chinese will not give him carte Blanche . I would agree without UN approval all so called peace keeping should be avoided.. Putins , expansionist ambitions is the cause of this friction. 

I didn't say Ukraine was Russian Good Old. But historically it was. If you want to ask me what has currently caused this tension, it was the stubbornness to not tell Zelensky he isn't getting NATO membership. The farce over that issue in particular for the last two months was probably the catalyst for all this and Russia I think wanted to send a message to Europe which is now loud and clear. Because if you are talking about security of Europe the first thing we can do is recognise that Ukraine is too close to Russia to think about militarization without a reaction and this is the reaction we will have if this goes on further. Ukraine as a buffer isn't just for Russian security it should be said, but ours as well. And as I said, I think talks will be successful because ultimately Russia want to prevent genocide and I can't see why Zelensky can't give up concessions here. Because Russia are now surrounding Keiv and although it won't be easy, the city will fall if Zelensky digs his heels much further.

[Sheepy]

I guess nobody in their right mind would believe a word Macron says either.
Minister backs down after 'financial war' on Russia comment — RT World News

[Good old]

Putin, is taking the piss, out of Macron, every bit as much or more as he is with any other western statesman or woman.  What was yesterdays Macron, agreement.? Oh yes, Putin wouldn't target civilians . Outcome rockets hitting civilian areas all over the country. 

[Good old]

Jesus Christ. What a load of drivel. It is kind of drivel that has caused the tensions we see today. What Putin has done is try and regain what he believes is Russian territory. He went into great deal about Lenin and explained why it is Russian. I think too much time has passed for that claim now. And Ukraine does have its own seat at the UN so unfortunately I think it too late to reclaim all of Ukraine. If he can get recognition for Crimea he would have done well. But in any case, he went into Ukraine for "peacekeeping" and the only reason we think this is bad is only because it is Europe and not anywhere else in the world. Which means I think we need to consider that the next time we think it is time to liberate a sovereign state because otherwise how else can you support this narrative.

The drivel is all yours . Ukraine is not Russian territory. End of. The fact that he believes it is , is the real problem. Russia, could ,and in history even recent lays claims to everyone of its neighbours territory. Putins ambition lays in the past.  He doesn't need provocation  just excuse and those ancient claims are all the excuse he needs. Yes Ukraine has a seat in the UN. That should tell you their status. and as such they should under no circumstance have to endure him conducting a major military intrusion in all parts of Ukraine killing civilians and military alike under the excuse of being  a peace keeper.  The reason his actions are thought dangerous to Europe, is precisely because it's Europe he disrupts.  And because of the spurious nature of his reasoning , an open threat to the peace of Europe. As a so called peace keeper UN backing would have helped . He hasn't got it , in fact even the Chinese will not give him carte Blanche . I would agree without UN approval all so called peace keeping should be avoided.. Putins , expansionist ambitions is the cause of this friction.  

[B0ycey]

Macron doing the hard yards he'll need more than a few yards because he's about as popular as a pork cop at a bar mitzvah in France.

He is polling well in the grand scheme of things. He will win the presidency.

[cromwell]

Barry, the EU was uniting over Brexit. It is totally in unison now. And the UK is now even further out the diplomatic standing than it was before. Does anyone listen to the UK these days? Macron is doing the hard yards right now not the clown Johnson. And soon those Tories who thirst for power of whatver kind, when they see the EU getting bigger and us being pushed further out, the end result will be rejoining.

Macron doing the hard yards  he'll need more than a few yards because he's about as popular as a pork cop at a bar mitzvah in France. 

[B0ycey]

Stop it Boycey, I'm running out of clean pants. 😂😂😂

Barry, the EU was uniting over Brexit. It is totally in unison now. And the UK is now even further out the diplomatic standing than it was before. Does anyone listen to the UK these days? Macron is doing the hard yards right now not the clown Johnson. And soon those Tories who thirst for power of whatver kind, when they see the EU getting bigger and us being pushed further out, the end result will be rejoining.

[B0ycey]

If anything will drive Europe, all the quicker toward a more and more unified state . It's Putins blatant disrespect and murderous military occupations,  of any nation that yearns to chose freedom from his influence.
Do as he says, leave him be is your mantra. And which just happens to be his. You repeat his message . Interfere , try to stop our sculduggery and we will make you suffer . He says.
What ?. Just as Ukraine suffers, is that to be accepted?  Fobbed off of what? Being top dog.through force of arms. A strategy that could only reduce Europe to the state Ukraine ,will be in soon, even if the outcome was unsuccessful for him.?
He is deliberate, a deliberate madman.  The power mongers as you describe them, not my description , should never stand back, and I for one hope they never will. Because the only attitude to the Putins of this world that will ever give him reason to reconsider is one that doesn't contain any indication that what he does is right in any way , or will be excused  in any way.

Jesus Christ. What a load of drivel. It is kind of drivel that has caused the tensions we see today. What Putin has done is try and regain what he believes is Russian territory. He went into great deal about Lenin and explained why it is Russian. I think too much time has passed for that claim now. And Ukraine does have its own seat at the UN so unfortunately I think it too late to reclaim all of Ukraine. If he can get recognition for Crimea he would have done well. But in any case, he went into Ukraine for "peacekeeping" and the only reason we think this is bad is only because it is Europe and not anywhere else in the world. Which means I think we need to consider that the next time we think it is time to liberate a sovereign state because otherwise how else can you support this narrative.

[Sheepy]

But on the brightside I bet I can read an article on RT today and if I decide it has some relevance, I can produce it without a lot of pointless comments. Barry will think I have a magic wand.

[Barry]

We are perhaps a few years of the formation of super states and the British only just walked out of the EU. [highlight]It seems our return isn't that far away.[/highlight]

Stop it Boycey, I'm running out of clean pants. 😂😂😂

[Sheepy]

Well I have said else where he is not a bear. He is a nasty deluded bit of work in human form. With no excuses .
If anyone should get mauled it will only be that's what it took to put an end to his sub human activities.
If he don't F—k off back to actual Russian territory and soon , I don't know about Cromwell .but I will gladly wear a thick coat . I don't have enough against real Bears to want their coats. Putin can have his gas the price was already to high. Raping Ukraine , has  put the real cost beyond even considering.

Well let's hope you don't explode when he produces the evidence of atrocities in Donbass then. Let's see who will try and cover them up. Like I keep telling you he isn't some maniac but very clever in his actions and the way the Russians have gone about them, even to the stage of giving them time to come to their senses. Like I said to Boycey, I wouldn't bet on it. You are always the same Goodold wrapped in all the drama and don't see a thing. 

[Good old]

If you are determined to go around poking bears under the guise of the greater good, don't be surprised when you get mauled oh great white hunters, just saying. By the way gas prices are rocketing but apparently, it's all good because we have plenty of the stuff even if it is a little expensive. I hope you and Cromwell have a nice fur coat, maybe made of bearskin. 

Well I have said else where he is not a bear. He is a nasty deluded bit of work in human form. With no excuses .
If anyone should get mauled it will only be that's what it took to put an end to his sub human activities.
If he don't F—k off back to actual Russian territory and soon , I don't know about Cromwell .but I will gladly wear a thick coat . I don't have enough against real Bears to want their coats. Putin can have his gas the price was already to high. Raping Ukraine , has  put the real cost beyond even considering.

[Sheepy]

A pity a realistic outcome can not now be reached until Europes latest candidate for mega maniac of the century has done his dirty work. Putin, certainly thrives on the drama of it all. Like most criminals. Let's hope he starts paying attention to the lessons of the past. Because they rarely end well.

If you are determined to go around poking bears under the guise of the greater good, don't be surprised when you get mauled oh great white hunters, just saying. By the way gas prices are rocketing but apparently, it's all good because we have plenty of the stuff even if it is a little expensive. I hope you and Cromwell have a nice fur coat, maybe made of bearskin.