Can we forgive?

[cromwell]

Well whilst it has been pointed out earlier in the thread that what happened generations ago is not our fault and we shouldn't be apologising for it is entirely true.

It is worth saying though that in return quoting the philanthropy of those involved in the slave trade isn't valid either,they were compensated the equivalent of millions in today's money which was given to them on the back of govt borrowing which I have read we have only just repaid recently so they were only distributing money that others would pay for.

When we look back though at the furore over the slave trade bad as it was conditions for the poor of this country weren't great,women and children working in mines almost as bad as slavery but it was what it was,you can't turn back the clock and forgiving or hating long dead people is pointless as is pulling down statues,that is only valid if it's a majority decision and they mostly are lumps of metal or stone that most walk past without a glance or care of who they were.

[Borchester]

We should forgive everybody everything,because if we don't we end up in mega sulks that go on and on and make us look complete dicks or whatever the girlie equivalent is.

[Borg Refinery]

A lot of peopoe still hate his guts more than Blair.

What do you mean?

I love tony blair. The man single handedly destroyed the labour party , opened the door wide open for the SNP in scotland and brexit in England .

When scotland gains its independence , talking about monuments , i will be petitioning the scottish government for a statue to blair and services rendered to the yes movement.

Blair's thinktanks and others seem to be subverting your movement as we speak.

They've gotten to quite a lot of people. You seem so confident they won't xheat and sneakily ruin the ref again?

How are you going to stop them this time round? Have you thougyt about that?

Im sure the BNP , then farage and ukip/brexit party must secretly be loving the mistakes the man made in his time such as flooding england with mass uncontrolled immigration which again opened the door to the rise in massive discontent in england and eventually led to brexit.

🤣 Yeah...I'm sure they're loving the exponential increases in immigration so much that they're smiling about it up and down the country, while Griffin is bankrupt, backstabbed by his own members - and Farage backstabbed UKIP into oblibion and then the Brexit party too.

Simply ecstatic about it, no doubt.

I don't hate English nationalists in any way, but UKIP and the BNP had rotten foyndations that felled the rest of the structure.

Start a proper English national party that looks after the English and then I'll seriously consider it.[/size]

[johnofgwent]

I only forgive family ,everyone else's name stays in 'the book '   

Oh no. They stay unforgiven.

After my brother decided the first we'd know about his son getting married was the facebook posts from the reception, jennifer went on a full nine yards rant ending well if he thinks hes coming to my and ollie's wedding hes got another think coming

Prompting me to say Who's Ollie?

Seriously, family feuds are the best.

[T00ts]

We can and should forgive, without forgetting. My mother used to say "If you say sorry, it means you won't do it again".
At the same time we need to stop apologising for things which happened before any of us were born. We are not responsible for the sins of our forefathers, any more than they are responsible for our current day peccadilloes.

Gosh you suddenly reminded me of God's promise that the sins of the fathers will affect 3rd and 4th generations or words to that effect.  Can't think of the ref but I must give that some thought. Of course repentance would be very relevant. What a thought!

[Barry]

We can and should forgive, without forgetting. My mother used to say "If you say sorry, it means you won't do it again".
At the same time we need to stop apologising for things which happened before any of us were born. We are not responsible for the sins of our forefathers, any more than they are responsible for our current day peccadilloes.

[Streetwalker]

I only forgive family ,everyone else's name stays in 'the book '   

[johnofgwent]

I had an illegal cuddle yesterday. I am still on lockdown so shouldn't see anyone, but we stayed in the garden and distanced except when I held my 8 month old grandson who in the last 3 months has changed so dramatically. Naughty but nice.

Each time we have skyped I have sung the same song to him and it was only when I softly sang again that he recognised me. Heartbreaking!

I can just about remember how the kids changed from week to week when I was off on contract when Sarah was 4 and jennifer one week old.

Jennifer used to look at me a bit wierd and moira would say shes wondering who that strange man is. Then she would bend down and say softly in jennifers ear 'he's the wallet that pays the bills'

And she bloody well remembered ....

It's a hell of a dilemma isnt it. Up the road there's an old biddy who doctors say is going to shuffle off her mortal coil soon thanks to the illness who is torn by a desire to see her grandkids one last time.

The arse book group she posted in dont normally like swearing or incitement to violence.

But when I posted that she should take her last chance, I'll stand at their driveway and if any jerk in uniform tries to stop her I'll happily do time for flooring them - after all, how different to house arrest here could prison possibly be ... the above peppered with anglo Saxon... the admins let it stand and hundreds said they'd give me a hand....

[Thomas]

A lot of peopoe still hate his guts more than Blair.

What do you mean?

I love tony blair. The man single handedly destroyed the labour party , opened the door wide open for the SNP in scotland and brexit in England .

When scotland gains its independence , talking about monuments , i will be petitioning the scottish government for a statue to blair and services rendered to the yes movement.

Im sure the BNP , then farage and ukip/brexit party must secretly be loving the mistakes the man made in his time such as flooding england with mass uncontrolled immigration which again opened the door to the rise in massive discontent in england and eventually led to brexit.

[Borg Refinery]

So can we forgive?

Can we forgive all those that have made mistakes, disagreed, annoyed us, hurt us in reality or in our imaginations?

In order... yes, yes, maybe, f**k no and finally, believe me, in my imagination they end up subjects in my experiments....

And is it sunday ? every days the bloody same in this bloody house arrest - still havent had the grand daughter around.

Well I guess that was expected - sorry to revive those memories. I had an illegal cuddle yesterday. I am still on lockdown so shouldn't see anyone, but we stayed in the garden and distanced except when I held my 8 month old grandson who in the last 3 months has changed so dramatically. Naughty but nice. Each time we have skyped I have sung the same song to him and it was only when I softly sang again that he recognised me. Heartbreaking!

It's unbelievable that this is now considered normal. I would write a long angry rant at the govt but that's not in keeming with your thread.

Don't feel bad about it. In many ways I am really grateful that I have been protected and continue to be so. It's no-one's fault that my condition makes me extra vulnerable but I have been touched by how careful so many have been particularly delivery people. It has been a challenge of course at times but the bottom line is that I am still here. Although of course some might regret that!   

That's a sweet sentiment.


Who might regret that? No one here I should think. If you're referring to the arguments every now and then, well it'd be so boring if we agreed on everything all the time.

[T00ts]

So can we forgive?

Can we forgive all those that have made mistakes, disagreed, annoyed us, hurt us in reality or in our imaginations?

In order... yes, yes, maybe, f**k no and finally, believe me, in my imagination they end up subjects in my experiments....

And is it sunday ? every days the bloody same in this bloody house arrest - still havent had the grand daughter around.

Well I guess that was expected - sorry to revive those memories. I had an illegal cuddle yesterday. I am still on lockdown so shouldn't see anyone, but we stayed in the garden and distanced except when I held my 8 month old grandson who in the last 3 months has changed so dramatically. Naughty but nice. Each time we have skyped I have sung the same song to him and it was only when I softly sang again that he recognised me. Heartbreaking!

It's unbelievable that this is now considered normal. I would write a long angry rant at the govt but that's not in keeming with your thread.

Don't feel bad about it. In many ways I am really grateful that I have been protected and continue to be so. It's no-one's fault that my condition makes me extra vulnerable but I have been touched by how careful so many have been particularly delivery people. It has been a challenge of course at times but the bottom line is that I am still here. Although of course some might regret that!   

[Borg Refinery]

So can we forgive?

Can we forgive all those that have made mistakes, disagreed, annoyed us, hurt us in reality or in our imaginations?

In order... yes, yes, maybe, f**k no and finally, believe me, in my imagination they end up subjects in my experiments....

And is it sunday ? every days the bloody same in this bloody house arrest - still havent had the grand daughter around.

Well I guess that was expected - sorry to revive those memories. I had an illegal cuddle yesterday. I am still on lockdown so shouldn't see anyone, but we stayed in the garden and distanced except when I held my 8 month old grandson who in the last 3 months has changed so dramatically. Naughty but nice. Each time we have skyped I have sung the same song to him and it was only when I softly sang again that he recognised me. Heartbreaking!

It's unbelievable that this is now considered normal. I would write a long angry rant at the govt but that's not in keeming with your thread.

[Borg Refinery]

Best to do all that you describe in & with private company. I think that's as good as it'll get in this climate.


I personally forgive Bush because he appeared to have turned a corner and apologized for his mistakes. A lot of peopoe still hate his guts more than Blair.


There's also the pressure that forgiving is seen as not bladhy maaanly, only wusses forgive...there's that too, which is silly but you know how it is.

[T00ts]

So can we forgive?

Can we forgive all those that have made mistakes, disagreed, annoyed us, hurt us in reality or in our imaginations?

In order... yes, yes, maybe, f**k no and finally, believe me, in my imagination they end up subjects in my experiments....

And is it sunday ? every days the bloody same in this bloody house arrest - still havent had the grand daughter around.

Well I guess that was expected - sorry to revive those memories. I had an illegal cuddle yesterday. I am still on lockdown so shouldn't see anyone, but we stayed in the garden and distanced except when I held my 8 month old grandson who in the last 3 months has changed so dramatically. Naughty but nice. Each time we have skyped I have sung the same song to him and it was only when I softly sang again that he recognised me. Heartbreaking!

[johnofgwent]

So can we forgive?

Can we forgive all those that have made mistakes, disagreed, annoyed us, hurt us in reality or in our imaginations?

In order... yes, yes, maybe, f**k no and finally, believe me, in my imagination they end up subjects in my experiments....

And is it sunday ? every days the bloody same in this bloody house arrest - still havent had the grand daughter around.