Why Labour lost.

[T00ts]

And incidentally, I personally am not in any way involved with momentum at all. But you'll still keep citing it in exchanges as if I am I am sure. Because on such issues you and your ilk on the right don't listen, you just spout the same old shit because you think it sounds good, no matter how many times it is denied.
[/quote]

I did not reference any link to Momentum and have no idea if you are. In fact I am not aware of ever responding to one of your posts before. I find it odd that you protest so much.

[srb7677]

Isn't the truth more that Blair and  co (and I loathe him too) dragged the Labour party kicking and screaming into a position where they could get on the right set of benches in Westminster? Isn't it relevant that since then in line with the party's slump to the outer edges of sensible politics, they have sunk to even lower depths than before Blair?  Don't get me wrong, I am more than happy with their current position - long may it last, but if Momentum etc are allowed to rise again - goodbye Labour.
(

Free broadband was undoubtedly a promise too far but most of our policies from 2017 - which we should have stuck with for 2019 - were very moderate, and popular according to polling. Here is the evidence....

https://www.businessinsider.com/poll-huge-public-support-for-jeremy-corbyns-manifesto-promises-2017-5?r=US&IR=T

It was not these that cost us the election but other factors, notably Brexit, the personal unpopularity of Corbyn due to a failure to combat smears, and treachery and disunity from our own right wing. The policies themselves were clearly not on "the outer edges of sensible politics". In fact, pre-Blair they would have been regarded as pretty mainstream. Even David Owen said his own SDP had been more left wing than that.

But misrepresent us all you like. It is a common trope on the right so I know you'll not desist from it.

And incidentally, I personally am not in any way involved with momentum at all. But you'll still keep citing it in exchanges as if I am I am sure. Because on such issues you and your ilk on the right don't listen, you just spout the same old shit because you think it sounds good, no matter how many times it is denied.

[T00ts]

while you and your momentum buddies were trying and failing to stab starmer and the blairites in the back , and causing general mayhem in labour with your bitter hatred of the blairite faction 

I think you will find it was the other way around. The Blairite faction constantly stabbing us in the back, briefings in the Tory press, plottings, joining demos against their own party. Some left to attack us from outside, others on their way out urged their constituents to vote conservative. We were the ones being stabbed in the back. Starmer is where he is today purely because he was one of the few wise enough not to participate and to work with the former leadership.

Isn't the truth more that Blair and  co (and I loathe him too) dragged the Labour party kicking and screaming into a position where they could get on the right set of benches in Westminster? Isn't it relevant that since then in line with the party's slump to the outer edges of sensible politics, they have sunk to even lower depths than before Blair?  Don't get me wrong, I am more than happy with their current position - long may it last, but if Momentum etc are allowed to rise again - goodbye Labour.
(

[srb7677]

while you and your momentum buddies were trying and failing to stab starmer and the blairites in the back , and causing general mayhem in labour with your bitter hatred of the blairite faction 

I think you will find it was the other way around. The Blairite faction constantly stabbing us in the back, briefings in the Tory press, plottings, joining demos against their own party. Some left to attack us from outside, others on their way out urged their constituents to vote conservative. We were the ones being stabbed in the back. Starmer is where he is today purely because he was one of the few wise enough not to participate and to work with the former leadership.

[T00ts]

Just thinking about it and how evident Starmer has been.  I remember him and his wife clapping for the NHS and some wag lip read his comment to photographers asking if he had done enough for their photos, he then retired back into his house.

I have seen BJ wearing masks mixing with the peasants but have yet to see Starmer in his mask. Perhaps like Corbyn he thinks it doesn't apply to him.

[T00ts]

I thank our good luck and massive national common sense that he was not in No 10 to oversee Covid, because the puppeteers pulling his strings while Labour leader were even worse than him

Tbf though Toots (and I detest the man), he'd have to have been pretty bad to have made a worse job of it than the shower we have, be honest? 

Fair enough but I  found it interesting that Hunt who just lost to BJ was heard saying that he felt he had dodged a bullet. We must all agree that it has been a crazy time for every government worldwide in the face of a virus that took so many by surprise. I am prepared to accept that they were and still are doing the best they can under the circumstances where even Governments are getting mixed messages from 'science/medics' and Uncle Tom Cobbley.

Hind sight is great isn't it?

It should not have required hindsight to figure out that whilst imposing major restrictions upon the population, allowing aircraft loads of incomers to come in, untested and unquarantined, often from virus hotspots, was utterly idiotic. The average ten year old could have figured that one out.

And that's just a typical example of the hopeless performance we have seen.

ok but much of what you say was replicated in many other countries , by many differeing governments.

Where were labour on the matter?

Hindsight is a wonderfull thing , but while you and your momentum buddies were trying and failing to stab starmer and the blairites in the back , and causing general mayhem in labour with your bitter hatred of the blairite faction  , johnson and the tories , and sturgeon and the snp , were leading the fight against covid on the front line. Labour were no where to be seen , except belatedly as ever carping from the sidelines when they took a breather from their infighting.

Sure , the snp and the tories have made mistakes , so has many other governments in dealing with a virtual unknown situation , but labour wouldnt have done any better then either , and certainly look as though they would have done much worse.

Again I agree with you - (Note to self - don't make a habit of it!) 

[Thomas]

I thank our good luck and massive national common sense that he was not in No 10 to oversee Covid, because the puppeteers pulling his strings while Labour leader were even worse than him

Tbf though Toots (and I detest the man), he'd have to have been pretty bad to have made a worse job of it than the shower we have, be honest? 

Fair enough but I  found it interesting that Hunt who just lost to BJ was heard saying that he felt he had dodged a bullet. We must all agree that it has been a crazy time for every government worldwide in the face of a virus that took so many by surprise. I am prepared to accept that they were and still are doing the best they can under the circumstances where even Governments are getting mixed messages from 'science/medics' and Uncle Tom Cobbley.

Hind sight is great isn't it?

It should not have required hindsight to figure out that whilst imposing major restrictions upon the population, allowing aircraft loads of incomers to come in, untested and unquarantined, often from virus hotspots, was utterly idiotic. The average ten year old could have figured that one out.

And that's just a typical example of the hopeless performance we have seen.

ok but much of what you say was replicated in many other countries , by many differeing governments.

Where were labour on the matter?

Hindsight is a wonderfull thing , but while you and your momentum buddies were trying and failing to stab starmer and the blairites in the back , and causing general mayhem in labour with your bitter hatred of the blairite faction  , johnson and the tories , and sturgeon and the snp , were leading the fight against covid on the front line. Labour were no where to be seen , except belatedly as ever carping from the sidelines when they took a breather from their infighting.

Sure , the snp and the tories have made mistakes , so has many other governments in dealing with a virtual unknown situation , but labour wouldnt have done any better then either , and certainly look as though they would have done much worse.

[srb7677]

I thank our good luck and massive national common sense that he was not in No 10 to oversee Covid, because the puppeteers pulling his strings while Labour leader were even worse than him

Tbf though Toots (and I detest the man), he'd have to have been pretty bad to have made a worse job of it than the shower we have, be honest? 

Fair enough but I  found it interesting that Hunt who just lost to BJ was heard saying that he felt he had dodged a bullet. We must all agree that it has been a crazy time for every government worldwide in the face of a virus that took so many by surprise. I am prepared to accept that they were and still are doing the best they can under the circumstances where even Governments are getting mixed messages from 'science/medics' and Uncle Tom Cobbley.

Hind sight is great isn't it?

It should not have required hindsight to figure out that whilst imposing major restrictions upon the population, allowing aircraft loads of incomers to come in, untested and unquarantined, often from virus hotspots, was utterly idiotic. The average ten year old could have figured that one out.

And that's just a typical example of the hopeless performance we have seen.

[DeppityDawg]

Ouch! 

[T00ts]

I thank our good luck and massive national common sense that he was not in No 10 to oversee Covid, because the puppeteers pulling his strings while Labour leader were even worse than him

Tbf though Toots (and I detest the man), he'd have to have been pretty bad to have made a worse job of it than the shower we have, be honest? 

Fair enough but I  found it interesting that Hunt who just lost to BJ was heard saying that he felt he had dodged a bullet. We must all agree that it has been a crazy time for every government worldwide in the face of a virus that took so many by surprise. I am prepared to accept that they were and still are doing the best they can under the circumstances where even Governments are getting mixed messages from 'science/medics' and Uncle Tom Cobbley.

Hind sight is great isn't it?

[Thomas]

you lose indyref 2, I'll keep the laces handy for you..

I heard that one dyno after indyref 1. We are still here  and smiling.

Brexit wont be the cause of the break up of the uk. Brexit is a symptom of the uks break up , which has been going on for the last century since ireland left.

[DeppityDawg]

I thank our good luck and massive national common sense that he was not in No 10 to oversee Covid, because the puppeteers pulling his strings while Labour leader were even worse than him

Tbf though Toots (and I detest the man), he'd have to have been pretty bad to have made a worse job of it than the shower we have, be honest? 

[srb7677]

So you can take your good half-haggis, half-aberdeen angus self and shove your head straight up a shetland pony's ass where it belongs..if it's not firmly lodged up there already. 

LMFAO.

[Borg Refinery]

Thanks for offering me some of your prozac hen.

Thanks   but I think you should keep having it instead.

dont need it mate.

prozac is an anti depressant  , and im so happy having a whale of a time pulling your leg over brexit .

im literally rolling around laughing like feck at you.

Im guessing as the weeks go by , you are going to get more depressed and more hysterical , hence the offer.

..and if twump gets re elected......well feck me , better hide the shoelaces dyno eh?

Of course you don't need it mate.. that you get free prescriptions for it..

..And if Scotland nosedives because of Boris and the power grab goes through, or you lose indyref 2, I'll keep the laces handy for you..

[Thomas]

Thanks for offering me some of your prozac hen.

Thanks   but I think you should keep having it instead.

dont need it mate.

prozac is an anti depressant  , and im so happy having a whale of a time pulling your leg over brexit .

im literally rolling around laughing like feck at you.

Im guessing as the weeks go by , you are going to get more depressed and more hysterical , hence the offer.

..and if twump gets re elected......well feck me , better hide the shoelaces dyno eh?