The Windsor Framework, getting Brexit undone

[Nick]

UK left the EU at beginning of 2020, however there was a transition period where the UK effectively remained in the single market until the end of 2020 to give the UK time to set up it's border systems.

the border systems were delayed in 2021 for 6 months because they were't ready  https://www.reuters.com/article/us-britain-eu-nireland-idUSKBN2B327F
then again late 2021.... https://www.reuters.com/world/uk/britain-delays-implementation-post-brexit-trade-controls-2021-09-14/
again in early 2022..... https://www.reuters.com/world/uk/britain-scraps-plans-post-brexit-import-controls-2022-04-28/
and now again in mid 2023.... https://www.reuters.com/world/uk/uk-says-it-is-assessing-eu-import-plan-after-report-new-delay-2023-08-03/

This time there are reports that the UK may just scrap the idea all together.

There is a major difference between the two delays.

The EU software system is being delayed because of commissioning issues (the software doesn't yet work!) but the EU want it to occur because it will make borders even smoother.

The UK border checks are being delayed because the economic damage of making the borders harder by implementing the checks will be so bad the current government, whose idea it was, can't stomach it.

The EES is being delayed because Spain and Portugal don't want it, as it will impact drastically on their one big industry, tourism. And almost a quarter of all tourists to Spain were Brits. I've even been told by a border agent in Germany that the EES may never be brought in because of the above, remember, as Gerry always tells us, nothing gets done unless all 27 agree.

[BeElBeeBub]

Things always get pushed back, nothing gets implemented on time. Same in the EU regarding the EES, almost 5 years late.
https://www.schengenvisainfo.com/news/eu-confirms-it-doesnt-have-a-date-for-implementation-of-entry-exit-system-yet/

Where is your link to the U.K. checks delay?

UK left the EU at beginning of 2020, however there was a transition period where the UK effectively remained in the single market until the end of 2020 to give the UK time to set up it's border systems.

the border systems were delayed in 2021 for 6 months because they were't ready  https://www.reuters.com/article/us-britain-eu-nireland-idUSKBN2B327F
then again late 2021.... https://www.reuters.com/world/uk/britain-delays-implementation-post-brexit-trade-controls-2021-09-14/
again in early 2022..... https://www.reuters.com/world/uk/britain-scraps-plans-post-brexit-import-controls-2022-04-28/
and now again in mid 2023.... https://www.reuters.com/world/uk/uk-says-it-is-assessing-eu-import-plan-after-report-new-delay-2023-08-03/

This time there are reports that the UK may just scrap the idea all together.

There is a major difference between the two delays.

The EU software system is being delayed because of commissioning issues (the software doesn't yet work!) but the EU want it to occur because it will make borders even smoother.

The UK border checks are being delayed because the economic damage of making the borders harder by implementing the checks will be so bad the current government, whose idea it was, can't stomach it.

[Nick]

See above.


So why are there numerous posts by you saying you won't touch meat from Oz, Argentina or US, citing poor standards?

Any response @papasmurf?

[Nick]

It's widely reported that the import (from EU) checks the UK was planning to implement post brexit have not yet been implemented.  In fact, it's now reported that the delayed implementation date of October 2023 (for the paperwork, physical checks were already pushed back to 2024) is going to be pushed back for the 5th time.

"Assumed" may be the wrong word.  It implies the government cares about the import protection at all and is assuming all will be well whilst they delay implementation again.

It could well be they don't give a toss in which case the correct wording would be

"That is no longer the case and the UK is no longer policing imports from the EU"

Things always get pushed back, nothing gets implemented on time. Same in the EU regarding the EES, almost 5 years late. 
https://www.schengenvisainfo.com/news/eu-confirms-it-doesnt-have-a-date-for-implementation-of-entry-exit-system-yet/

Where is your link to the U.K. checks delay?

[BeElBeeBub]

Who says the U.K. is assuming anything? Where do you get that from?

It's widely reported that the import (from EU) checks the UK was planning to implement post brexit have not yet been implemented.  In fact, it's now reported that the delayed implementation date of October 2023 (for the paperwork, physical checks were already pushed back to 2024) is going to be pushed back for the 5th time.

"Assumed" may be the wrong word.  It implies the government cares about the import protection at all and is assuming all will be well whilst they delay implementation again.

It could well be they don't give a toss in which case the correct wording would be 

"That is no longer the case and the UK is no longer policing imports from the EU"

[Nick]

But are we checking those.?

Pre Brexit we had facilities for checking foodstuffs from nonEU arriving directly into the EU via the UK. But this was a limited volume because most of that stuff went to the big euro ports which had the space and facilities to do so.

Effectively we outsourced checking to other ports.

Our EU facing ports like dover didn't need any (and can't provide) facilties because anything coming across the channel would be fully checked and compliant already.

That is no longer the case and the UK is continuing to run on the assumption that if it comes from an EU port it must be kosher, which was true and now is not always true.

Who says the U.K. is assuming anything? Where do you get that from?

[Nick]

This is true ,it was though a health risk to the waiter in Mons who after I had asked if the Chateubriand they had on the menue for e20 (I should have known better) was indeed beef he replied, the very best sir .

Its turned up as Horsemeat , Ive tried it before and not a fan . So Im saying Im not paying for that ,take it away,your not having me for a mug bla bla  ect  ect ,row starts ,getting heated then the boss then comes out and says I need to learn to read the menu and not rely on his dumbfuck waiter . What it actually said was
Chateubriant , todays winners freshly cooked to your liking

So we shared a bottle or two of wine with the bloke paid the bill and went back the next night for a proper steak he promised us on the house . With the Merlot at e50 a bottle I don't suppose he was out of pocket

Having worked in China I'm guessing I've eaten most things, cant ever remember having horse though, not even in France or Switzerland.

Nothing back from Smurf on the petroleum products!!

[Streetwalker]

And having a meat that people find distasteful to eat is not a health risk.

This is true ,it was though a health risk to the waiter in Mons who after I had asked if the Chateubriand they had on the menue for e20 (I should have known better) was indeed beef he replied, the very best sir .

Its turned up as Horsemeat , Ive tried it before and not a fan . So Im saying Im not paying for that ,take it away,your not having me for a mug bla bla  ect  ect ,row starts ,getting heated then the boss then comes out and says I need to learn to read the menu and not rely on his dumbfuck waiter . What it actually said was
Chateubriant , todays winners freshly cooked to your liking

So we shared a bottle or two of wine with the bloke paid the bill and went back the next night for a proper steak he promised us on the house . With the Merlot at e50 a bottle I don't suppose he was out of pocket

[Borchester]

Printing ink is a known cause of cancer which is why fish and chips stopped being wrapped in it a very long time ago.

Modern printing ink is largely based on soy bean, which I bloody well loathe and and am happy to hear should be abolished.

Years ago I was in the print, which was largely a family business so we the put the fact that so many of our coworkers were freaks of once sort or another down to the inbreeding. There were rumours that the old style lead type had something to do with it, but that was ignored.

[Nick]

It came close with the horsemeat scandal, and the petroleum products in cooking all.

The horse meat 'scandal' as you call it was well into our EU years. And having a meat that people find distasteful to eat is not a health risk. Petroleum products, I am not aware of. 

[papasmurf]

The remoaners at BBC strike again ,LOL . The only thing they could come up with out of thousands of imports was a few boxes of sea bream from Mexico in 2022 . I think most of us would have spotted it had it managed to get past the port , the fishmonger wholesaler , the fishmonger  counter at Waitrose and her indoors at the frying pan
Suffolk: Tongue-eating parasites enter UK through imported box of fish | Metro News

My guess is it wouldn't clear more than one of those hurdles

Its not being flippant papa its being responsible for yourself and knowing what your buying .

The BBC is only reporting. The lack of inspection is a VERY serious issue which the government is choosing to ignore.

[Streetwalker]

The lack of inspections is  real and present danger to Britain, your flippancy will not change that.

Brexit: Food safety checks on EU imports still unknown - BBC News

The remoaners at BBC strike again ,LOL . The only thing they could come up with out of thousands of imports was a few boxes of sea bream from Mexico in 2022 . I think most of us would have spotted it had it managed to get past the port , the fishmonger wholesaler , the fishmonger  counter at Waitrose and her indoors at the frying pan 
Suffolk: Tongue-eating parasites enter UK through imported box of fish | Metro News

My guess is it wouldn't clear more than one of those hurdles 

Its not being flippant papa its being responsible for yourself and knowing what your buying . 

[papasmurf]

The horsemeat scandal was in 2013 the EU was in charge of foodstuffs then . Thanks for proving that we can do without those chancers checking our food .

I would add though that there was niegh horsemeat in my home made burgers

The lack of inspections is  real and present danger to Britain, your flippancy will not change that.

Brexit: Food safety checks on EU imports still unknown - BBC News

[Streetwalker]

It came close with the horsemeat scandal, and the petroleum products in cooking all.

The horsemeat scandal was in 2013 the EU was in charge of foodstuffs then . Thanks for proving that we can do without those chancers checking our food . 

I would add though that there was niegh horsemeat in my home made burgers 

[papasmurf]

We nearly did, but then we started to wrap the fish and chips in copies of the Guardian and earned a brief respite.

Printing ink is a known cause of cancer which is why fish and chips stopped being wrapped in it a very long time ago.