British negotiator gives EU two-week deadline to drop ‘ideological’ stance

[Stevlin]

😂



I meant we are way past the point about Gerry 😂

Geeez Nick - that has been obvious for ages now!!   ;o)

[Stevlin]

I looked for the report on the web but can't find it. I remeber watching Junker repond to a reporter with the punish Uk statement the day the referendum result was announced



The recent issues of national interest over EU rules relate to the COVID19 crisis. Most of which I consider justified as in closing borders to prevent the spread although the commission itself condemed the independent action. Germany and France also banned the export of PPE equipment including to other EU countries



I may be worng about the german motor manufacturers meeting. I can find references to the boss of BMW wanting a meeting with Boris but I can't find references to it taking place, although I thought some representatives did actually travel to London last year concerned about no deal brexit

Well I can certainly recall that Junker was associated with 'a desire' to ensure that the UK were 'punished' to discourage other countries from following suit.

[Nick]

Not yet we aren't......we are still in the EU until the end of the year, and we still don't know what concessions will be made to avoid a 'no deal'...

😂



I meant we are way past the point about Gerry 😂

[Stevlin]

The UK has never been self sufficient in food, but it does surprise me that an island nation would not close that gap, but I've given up listening to some UK politicians, Johnson, Gove, Priti, Rabb... They just make it up, no plan. They wait for Cummings to tell them whats what.

Very true...but there are nearly 200 countries to source food from, WITHOUT having to subsidise and cede elements of sovereignty to a very minor group of countries - even if they are our neighbours.....and clearly, the UK does provide a lucrative market to the EU.....just ask Gerry  - but I wouldn't claim that Ireland would suffer as a result of Brexit....distances for goods to travel nowadays are from from being the handicap that it used to be - and sensible countries reach mutually advantageous Trade agreements - without requiring the use of a ridiculous supranational Parliament .... of course, they aren't hell bent on forming their equivalent of a United States of Europe, merely promoting trade growth.

[Stevlin]

May I introduce you to Stevlin.  I'm sure you two will get on famously.



Meanwhile, back on planet Earth...

Lol - spoken like a true Martian......'realism' and yourself just don't go together...as it cannot for anyone who believes an undemocratic  supranational  Parliament is a necessity for promoting mutual trade economic growth....no wonder you have never even attempted to justify it. It is absolutely obvious - even to the likes of you!

[Stevlin]

We are way passed that point.

Not yet we aren't......we are still in the EU until the end of the year, and we still don't know what concessions will be made to avoid a 'no deal'...

[kwhs10]

I looked for the report on the web but can't find it. I remeber watching Junker repond to a reporter with the punish Uk statement the day the referendum result was announced



The recent issues of national interest over EU rules relate to the COVID19 crisis. Most of which I consider justified as in closing borders to prevent the spread although the commission itself condemed the independent action. Germany and France also banned the export of PPE equipment including to other EU countries



I may be worng about the german motor manufacturers meeting. I can find references to the boss of BMW wanting a meeting with Boris but I can't find references to it taking place, although I thought some representatives did actually travel to London last year concerned about no deal brexit

[GerryT]

Actually I think we will end up with an FTA but not before the transition period ends. Since the EU is more dependant on the UK than we are on them these tarrifs are designed to hit them hardest. Once their industry starts to squeal and unemplyment rises tthen I thinkl a certain level of pragmatism will ensue, afterall no politician wants to be voted out due to their policies hitting the people who elect them. Also this will not affect global trade, the tarrifs would only be applied to the EU, under these circumstances once an FTA is agreed the EU would be faced with trying to recapture their market share from the global competitors who would have replaced them, which is much harder than keeping that share in the first place.

How on gods earth do you think the EU needs the UK more ?  

You need to brush up on WTO tariffs. If you set a tariff at 20% for say EU beef, then thats the tariff for beef from everywhere in the world. You can't have any difference. It's the most favoured nation rule of the WTO.

Do you know the market size difference of the EU and UK ?  

The EU has FTA's or bilateral trade deals with over 60 countries covering most of the globe

The UK at this rate on Jan1 2021 will have zero. It has a number of promises from some mickey mouse countries to do FTA's but we'll see how that goes.

You don't think there will be unemployment in the UK post a hard brexit, why ?

 

The idea of an FTA is to make the transition from the UK being a member to being independent as painless as possible for both the UK and the EU. Effectively we trade as before without the political interference in our affairs. The EU on the otherhand appear to have some serious issues relating to the stability of the entire EU project and wish to enforce a failure of the UK to go it alone as a warning to other states not to break away. When Junker expressed his opinion the UK should be punished for having the audacity to leave he wasn't the only EU politician to share such thoughs. Much of the negociation with Theresa May was aimed specifically at making a deal so obnoxious we would put our tails between our legs and ask the EU if they would be gracious enough to invite us back

Can you show where Juncker said he wanted to punish the UK. I think your confused. You not getting your way isn't you being punished. Like you have a right to leave the EU, the EU has a right to not give in to UK demands.

As we have seen recently national issues can surface to take precedence over the EU rules when it suits some nations. Mounting the pressure onto specific nations should envoke a level of national rebellion amoung some states to force the EU to adopt a different stance to the one they are currently persuing.

What EU rules have national issues taken precedence over, please outline what EU rule is being "ignored". I've no idea what your referring to.

Remember last year German motor manufacturers visited the UK to plead with the prime minister to give in so as not to damage their industry. Why didn't they turn up at Merkel's offices to make such appeals afterall she is resonosible for the wellbeing of Germany not our PM

Nope, I don't remember that at all.They didn't show up because German motor manufacturers are far more interested and concerned about the EU than they are about the UK. German cars are in the luxury bracket, you could stick 10k onto the price of a high end Merc/Audi/BMW and you'll still have a queue to buy them.

[Borg Refinery]

The UK has never been self sufficient in food, but it does surprise me that an island nation would not close that gap, but I've given up listening to some UK politicians, Johnson, Gove, Priti, Rabb... They just make it up, no plan. They wait for Cummings to tell them whats what.

IIRC we have one of the most efficient agricultural sectors in the EU. What a bloody shame to chuck that away to satisfy Dom's ideological twinges ....



Also it BSes the 'we care about the fishermen' bollox.

[GerryT]

No the plan is even more ridiculous than that Gerry..



https://metro.co.uk/2020/03/01/top-government-aide-said-britain-doesnt-need-farmers-fishermen-12327758/amp/">https://metro.co.uk/2020/03/01/top-gove ... 27758/amp/">https://metro.co.uk/2020/03/01/top-government-aide-said-britain-doesnt-need-farmers-fishermen-12327758/amp/



Also in the daily mail, sun etc...



As agriculture and fishing is 1% of gdp, the govt's logic says we can throw them to the wolves. Let's rely on others for fish, food and become singapore-on-thames. Ket's 'get rid' of our agricultural sector.



I'm not making it up, I couldn't, they genuinely believe this.



Then again, Boris said "f**k business" in 2016 when discussing no deal Brexit. He really does not care.

The UK has never been self sufficient in food, but it does surprise me that an island nation would not close that gap, but I've given up listening to some UK politicians, Johnson, Gove, Priti, Rabb... They just make it up, no plan. They wait for Cummings to tell them whats what.

[Borg Refinery]

Do you have the slightest idea of what your talking about. How will you buy foreign goods in january with such high global tariffs. Not until you sign trade deals can you move away from your tariff schedule. So what's your plan.



I'll give you one problem. 80% of cars you manufacture is sold abroad, with such high imports that's going to push up material costs and your selling price. Prob putting a stop to global car sales from the uk. Is that the plan ?



Blazing saddles sheriff tactic

No the plan is even more ridiculous than that Gerry..



https://metro.co.uk/2020/03/01/top-government-aide-said-britain-doesnt-need-farmers-fishermen-12327758/amp/">https://metro.co.uk/2020/03/01/top-gove ... 27758/amp/">https://metro.co.uk/2020/03/01/top-government-aide-said-britain-doesnt-need-farmers-fishermen-12327758/amp/



Also in the daily mail, sun etc...



As agriculture and fishing is 1% of gdp, the govt's logic says we can throw them to the wolves. Let's rely on others for fish, food and become singapore-on-thames. Ket's 'get rid' of our agricultural sector.



I'm not making it up, I couldn't, they genuinely believe this.



Then again, Boris said "F@@@ business" in 2016 when discussing no deal Brexit. He really does not care.

[Javert]

May I introduce you to Stevlin.  I'm sure you two will get on famously.



Meanwhile, back on planet Earth...

[kwhs10]

Actually I think we will end up with an FTA but not before the transition period ends. Since the EU is more dependant on the UK than we are on them these tarrifs are designed to hit them hardest. Once their industry starts to squeal and unemplyment rises tthen I thinkl a certain level of pragmatism will ensue, afterall no politician wants to be voted out due to their policies hitting the people who elect them. Also this will not affect global trade, the tarrifs would only be applied to the EU, under these circumstances once an FTA is agreed the EU would be faced with trying to recapture their market share from the global competitors who would have replaced them, which is much harder than keeping that share in the first place.



The idea of an FTA is to make the transition from the UK being a member to being independent as painless as possible for both the UK and the EU. Effectively we trade as before without the political interference in our affairs. The EU on the otherhand appear to have some serious issues relating to the stability of the entire EU project and wish to enforce a failure of the UK to go it alone as a warning to other states not to break away. When Junker expressed his opinion the UK should be punished for having the audacity to leave he wasn't the only EU politician to share such thoughs. Much of the negociation with Theresa May was aimed specifically at making a deal so obnoxious we would put our tails between our legs and ask the EU if they would be gracious enough to invite us back



As we have seen recently national issues can surface to take precedence over the EU rules when it suits some nations. Mounting the pressure onto specific nations should envoke a level of national rebellion amoung some states to force the EU to adopt a different stance to the one they are currently persuing.



Remember last year German motor manufacturers visited the UK to plead with the prime minister to give in so as not to damage their industry. Why didn't they turn up at Merkel's offices to make such appeals afterall she is resonosible for the wellbeing of Germany not our PM

[GerryT]

I can't see any reason to wait two weeks. The EU never had any intension of allowing the UK to leave amicably. Junker stated the day after the brexit referendum result "We will have to punish britain" Excuse me but the only group of people I know who punish a free and democratic society for choosing their own path to the future in a democratic way are called facists.

It is clear the EU just want our money for as long as they can get it, hence threats to extend the transition period because they can't be expected to work out an FTA in the time allowed



Well heres one we should throw at them to focus their minds



WTO rules 1st Jan Import duties of motor vehicles and accessories 20%, Import duties on agricultural goods 20%, import duties on everything else 15% PS keep ALL your trawlers out of our waters.



Simple only took 5 mins to work out whats all the fuss about not being able to set up an agreement in less than a year.



PS don't say we cannot set such tarrifs Trump did just that with both China and the EU because he did not like the existing trading terms.

Do you have the slightest idea of what your talking about. How will you buy foreign goods in january with such high global tariffs. Not until you sign trade deals can you move away from your tariff schedule. So what's your plan.



I'll give you one problem. 80% of cars you manufacture is sold abroad, with such high imports that's going to push up material costs and your selling price. Prob putting a stop to global car sales from the uk. Is that the plan ?



Blazing saddles sheriff tactic

[kwhs10]

I can't see any reason to wait two weeks. The EU never had any intension of allowing the UK to leave amicably. Junker stated the day after the brexit referendum result "We will have to punish britain" Excuse me but the only group of people I know who punish a free and democratic society for choosing their own path to the future in a democratic way are called facists.

It is clear the EU just want our money for as long as they can get it, hence threats to extend the transition period because they can't be expected to work out an FTA in the time allowed



Well heres one we should throw at them to focus their minds



WTO rules 1st Jan Import duties of motor vehicles and accessories 20%, Import duties on agricultural goods 20%, import duties on everything else 15% PS keep ALL your trawlers out of our waters.



Simple only took 5 mins to work out whats all the fuss about not being able to set up an agreement in less than a year.



PS don't say we cannot set such tarrifs Trump did just that with both China and the EU because he did not like the existing trading terms.