Not sure I've got the energy to ask

[patman post]

Strangely enough they are at odds with what I call experts. The trade deals with NZ and Australia will harm UK farmers.

https://www.nfuonline.com/updates-and-information/nfu-responds-to-finalised-uk-new-zealand-trade-deal/

Can't see where this harm is mentioned in your link.

NFU President Minette Batters said the UK-New Zealand deal, as with the one signed early this year with Australia, has little benefit for British farmers and that a coherent approach is needed to bolster UK farming's productivity.

"As expected, this deal takes the same approach as the UK-Australia deal in eliminating tariffs for agricultural products, meaning that even for sensitive sectors like beef and lamb, dairy and horticulture, in time there will be no limit to the amount of goods New Zealand can export to the UK.

"I have consistently pointed out that the real risk to UK farmers, and longer term for people wanting to buy British food, from the government's approach to trade deals is not the individual deals themselves but the cumulative impact of each deal when added together. This deal today shows I was right to be concerned."

We expect farmers to moan. And coming out of the CAP, probably means significant adaptation for many if they want to continue farming, and not remain subsidy junkies. The government has to help, not only with replacing/reforming EU subsidies but, for another thing, by stopping giant food industry players from running the market...

[Nick]

Strangely enough they are at odds with what I call experts. The trade deals with NZ and Australia will harm UK farmers.

https://www.nfuonline.com/updates-and-information/nfu-responds-to-finalised-uk-new-zealand-trade-deal/

Firstly your link states there is no benefit to British farmers, not that it will damage them. Secondly, I don't really care too much: they've sat on their arses for years being paid to grow nothing by the EU, now they're having to work for a change. 

[papasmurf]

Strangely enough, the people in the know don't agree with you, I'll believe them if you don't mind. Tesco has been selling NZ lamb with U.K. stamps on it for decades.

https://ahdb.org.uk/trade-and-policy/new-zealand-animal-welfare

It stated that the animal welfare standards in the UK and New Zealand are broadly equivalent, and that in some areas New Zealand standards may be above the UK's.

Strangely enough they are at odds with what I call experts. The trade deals with NZ and Australia will harm UK farmers.

https://www.nfuonline.com/updates-and-information/nfu-responds-to-finalised-uk-new-zealand-trade-deal/

[Nick]

It is NOT waffle, New Zealand does not even come close to the same animal welfare standards as Britain. Plus they are allowed to use drugs on animals that are banned in Britain.

Strangely enough, the people in the know don't agree with you, I'll believe them if you don't mind. Tesco has been selling NZ lamb with U.K. stamps on it for decades. 

https://ahdb.org.uk/trade-and-policy/new-zealand-animal-welfare

It stated that the animal welfare standards in the UK and New Zealand are broadly equivalent, and that in some areas New Zealand standards may be above the UK's.

[papasmurf]

You're wasting your time, he will never give you a straight answer, just a load of waffle.

It is NOT waffle, New Zealand does not even come close to the same animal welfare standards as Britain. Plus they are allowed to use drugs on animals that are banned in Britain.

[Nick]

Seems to me, as a non-farmer, that feeding sheep (and cattle) on grass for longer because of the larger areas of pasture and better pasture growing weather in NZ, and limiting (if not eliminating altogether) grain and other processed feed, would give better meat.

Then there's the additional point that NZ lamb doesn't have to travel as far to slaughter as in the UK, where supermarkets specify which particular abattoirs the animals have to be transported to...

You're wasting your time, he will never give you a straight answer, just a load of waffle. 

[papasmurf]

Seems to me, as a non-farmer,

That is the problem. 

[patman post]

Theyn would say that wouldn't they. It does not stand up to close inspection.

Seems to me, as a non-farmer, that feeding sheep (and cattle) on grass for longer because of the larger areas of pasture and better pasture growing weather in NZ, and limiting (if not eliminating altogether) grain and other processed feed, would give better meat.

Then there's the additional point that NZ lamb doesn't have to travel as far to slaughter as in the UK, where supermarkets specify which particular abattoirs the animals have to be transported to...

[papasmurf]

So NZ lamb — beloved by British housewives for decades, and British shoppers since the term housewives has been frowned on — has been of lesser quality and from poorer animal husbandry than more intensively reared lamb by UK farmers...?

https://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/wales-news/nz-lambs-better-environment-2240702

Theyn would say that wouldn't they. It does not stand up to close inspection.

[patman post]

Not forgotten at all, now it will be to the detriment of UK farmers because the Tory government will accept the lower welfare standards of sheep in New Zealand.

So NZ lamb — beloved by British housewives for decades, and British shoppers since the term housewives has been frowned on — has been of lesser quality and from poorer animal husbandry than more intensively reared lamb by UK farmers...?

https://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/wales-news/nz-lambs-better-environment-2240702

[papasmurf]

Care to say why...?

Frankly because you have nothing to back up your contention.

[papasmurf]

They all seem to forget that the U.K. traded with NZ before the common market and NZ lamb was all over the U.K. with no detriment to our farmers.

Not forgotten at all, now it will be to the detriment of UK farmers because the Tory government will accept the lower welfare standards of sheep in New Zealand.

[patman post]

Frankly that is a nonsensical statement.

Care to say why...?

[Nick]

Bad for some of those UK farmers who don't really benefit the British economy.

But the NZ agreement is not that much different from what the UK got for it (and from it) within the EU. And the Australian deal will add very little to existing trade.

Perhaps the opening up of movement of personnel aged up to 35 could be of benefit — though I can see it could encourage emigration to Aus of qualified people rather than in the other direction.

NZ is unlikely to be attractive to anyone who doesn't yearn for a Britain of 50 years ago...

They all seem to forget that the U.K. traded with NZ before the common market and NZ lamb was all over the U.K. with no detriment to our farmers. 

[papasmurf]

Bad for some of those UK farmers who don't really benefit the British economy.

Frankly that is a nonsensical statement.