NHS staff coronavirus inquests told not to look at PPE shortages

[DeppityDawg]

No, I won't shut up. Leftist mantras do not make the truth.

I don't think this government have covered themselves in glory over this whole sorry mess, but the usual predictable attempts to politicise matters like this are in full swing (Panorama for instance). You shouldn't be surprised that the forum zealot would be on that bandwagon. You've already shown up his made up claims in another thread, to which his response was silence. It's so fecking frustrating that his constant rubbish infects every thread but there it is. We WILL overcome  ::

[papasmurf]

 then in my view there should be mass protests on the streets and a general strike until the inquiry is announced.

That could still happen



A coroner can issue a notice to prevent further deaths based on just one case. The governent has a history of ignoring such notices, despite the fact outside of governmemt people can be, are are jailed for ignoring those notices.

[Javert]

Does this actually mean what papasmurf is assuming?



The way I read this, it's not up to an individual inquest to determine issues about high level systemic policy failure.



This should not mean however, that the inquest could not find that the person died because of an individual failure to have the PPE that they needed at a particular procedure.  I think that would still be allowed?



So they could find:



- Nurse x died because NHS trust Y forced them to carry out procedure Z on date w without adequate PPE being provided.



However they cannot find



- Nurse x died because of the UK government's failure to provide adequate PPE to the NHS and failure to plan properly.



If my interpretation is correct, this seems right to me because the latter part should be the subject of an independent public inquiry, and if no such inquiry is held, then in my view there should be mass protests on the streets and a general strike until the inquiry is announced.

[papasmurf]

No, I won't shut up. Leftist mantras do not make the truth.

Barry you are in denial. Why is something you really do need to address.

The lack of PPE is fact that you continue to deny that is frankly perverse. That you think that medical professionals can work on patients with Covid-19 with out adequate PPE and not risk death means you have a hidden agenda.

It is obvious political pressure is being put on Coronors in an indirect way. That is disgraceful.

.

[Barry]

Do shut up Barry, if you can't see a lack of PPE HAS killed NHS staff and others, I have to assume you are a Tory minister posting under a pseudonym,  and/or you are trolling.

No, I won't shut up. Leftist mantras do not make the truth.

[papasmurf]

Capital letters don't make this the truth.

Lack of PPE cannot be attributed to any deaths.

Do shut up Barry, if you can't see a lack of PPE HAS killed NHS staff and others, I have to assume you are a Tory minister posting under a pseudonym,  and/or you are trolling.

[Barry]

I agree, frankly I am VERY angry at the continual government excuses about the lack of PPE.  It HAS killed NHS staff, and others who should have had access to it.

Capital letters don't make this the truth.

Lack of PPE cannot be attributed to any deaths. Now post a link to a 240 page article that mentions PPE in it somewhere which you will say proves it did.

All from your Cornish Tory hate bunker.

[papasmurf]

Perhaps the Health & safety executive should be involved in this,isn't it within their remit to investigate the failure to protect in the workplace.

I agree, frankly I am VERY angry at the continual government excuses about the lack of PPE.  It HAS killed NHS staff, and others who should have had access to it.

[cromwell]

Perhaps the Health & safety executive should be involved in this,isn't it within their remit to investigate the failure to protect in the workplace.

[Hyperduck Quack Quack]

Surely inquests should be able to determine whether lack of PPE for a particular individual is likely to have contributed to their death.  Trying to prevent such discussion is very wrong.



If a cyclist has died after falling off their bike and they weren't wearing a cycle helmet, that is a very relevant fact.  



Whether an inquest should be involved in general discussion of PPE shortages is a slightly different matter.  If that cyclist owned a safety helmet but couldn't find it on the fateful day, that's not really relevant to the inquest.

[papasmurf]

This is bloody digraceful, (Sorry for a newpaper link, as there is no comment (yet) on TV news.)



More at link:-



https://www.theguardian.com/society/2020/apr/29/inquests-nhs-staff-deaths-ppe-shortages">https://www.theguardian.com/society/202 ... -shortages">https://www.theguardian.com/society/2020/apr/29/inquests-nhs-staff-deaths-ppe-shortages



Inquests into coronavirus deaths among NHS workers should avoid examining systemic failures in provision of personal protective equipment (PPE), coroners have been told, in a move described by Labour as "very worrying".



The chief coroner for England and Wales, Mark Lucraft QC, has issued guidance that "an inquest would not be a satisfactory means of deciding whether adequate general policies and arrangements were in place for provision of PPE to healthcare workers".



Lucraft said that "if there were reason to suspect that some human failure contributed to the person being infected with the virus", an inquest may be required. The coroner "may need to consider whether any failures of precautions in a particular workplace caused the deceased to contract the virus and so contributed to death".